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Around SBN: Has Kentucky Improved Since the Non-Conference Season?

Quick Cap: Dolphins 21 - Seahawks 19

Win or lose, Seattle's shot at making the playoffs barely budges. If the loss doesn't matter, the thread of contention lost, what matters now is how the team played. That might sound like palliative bullshit, but it's not. What matters now is building a team that can contend again. The foundation is there, and for the first time in a long time, so was the fight.

That team includes Julius Jones. Jones is a good running back with fringe benefits a Teamster wouldn't turn down. Jones counts just 1.5 million against the cap this season. He will continue to be cheap throughout his contract. Jones is a strong pass blocker. He's a good receiver. Jones has good vision, quickness, cutback ability and tackle breaking ability. People who want only flash will cry for Seattle to draft a "superstar" running back, but cheap as hell and not costing a draft pick is a pretty good price for an above average back.

That team includes Ray Willis, who has proven to be a better Floyd Womack. He's a capable right tackle and if today is any indication, a pretty good right guard.

That team includes John Carlson who's been so good people forget he's a rookie. Drops are one kind of incompletion, but one fans especially despise. It's a bit like an error in baseball. The error is ugly and we see it, but for a player to commit an error, they must first get to the ball. The error is usually no worse than if the play were never made. Carlson gets open. He's Seattle's leading receiver and even with today's 5 receptions for 10 targets showing, his catch rate is 61%. His drops are painful, but merely the bad end to a nearly successful play.

And that team includes Baraka Atkins. In fact, it includes virtually everyone on this roster. Seattle is young and cheap and talented throughout its ranks.

Seattle has a good young core and played hard against a better opponent. There's no trickery or rhetoric needed to feel hopeful about this team. It's been a hard year, but this, heartbreaking as it was, felt like the first signs of light.

Game Ball: Brandon Mebane. Mebane had two tackles today, for 0 and -1, both in the fourth quarter, both preventing first downs. The Dolphins ran behind left guard four times. The total yards gained on those runs: 4. Mebane now has three sacks from the one tech. He's the heart of this run defense. The reason teams no longer regularly break long runs. He's just 23, and still developing as a pass rusher. In a dismal season, Mebane keeps giving me things to care about. Game ball.

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I felt the same way after the game was over

Yeah, it was a bummer we lost, but damn some really exciting things happened in the process. If the younger players can continue progressing and someone new comes in to call plays, I’m very hopeful about next season.

by BrianL on Nov 9, 2008 2:53 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

this team includes keary colbert

who gets open oh so much but has the hands of a walking lamppost. catch a ball seahawks. catch a freaking football.

by Woodinville_12thMan on Nov 9, 2008 2:59 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

I really, really like the potential for this team when healthy

And given another coaching staff.

So much agreed on Jones… and i can’t understand for the life of me why Holmgren doesn’t run him more with the damn ball. He doesn’t appear to get tired, even getting better as the game goes on.

And yet, Holmgren throws the ball 37 times with an injured backup quarterback that – even when healthy – can’t hit a target unless it’s sitting completely still ten yards away?

It’s not like we were behind by two touchdowns the whole game.

by djafrot on Nov 9, 2008 3:06 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

Julius Jones

Jones is a work horse and could be having a season like his brother Thomas with the Jets. With Hass and Branch back next week Jones will have a huge game if Holms leaves him in for 16+ carries.

by hawkr on Nov 9, 2008 3:19 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

yeah

Holmgren must really have thought the road to victory led through Miami’s secondary. Cruising through the box score it looks like Jones had a solid day on the ground.

Oh yeah, with Robinson’s TD drop I remembered a bit of the old ultraviolence. I’d forgotten the aggravating days where our two top WRs were Koren Robinson and Darrell Jackson.

by Will Kier on Nov 9, 2008 3:25 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

even with KRob's drop, I think he's a keeper

He seems to be a threat all over the field.

by djafrot on Nov 9, 2008 3:33 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

And given

some good draft picks this coming year…

by m_b on Nov 9, 2008 3:37 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

We disagree on many things...

But we agree on this: Julius Jones is the RB that should be getting the rock a lot more than he has been.

by Azimeir on Nov 10, 2008 1:03 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

haha... what?

I don’t remember what we disagree on. But don’t remind me, actually.

by djafrot on Nov 10, 2008 1:21 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Lost in the losses

Is the fact that our team DVOA has been improving for I think the last 5 straight weeks. Granted, we started from a very low position, so there was a lot of room to improve, but after this showing against a team with a pretty solid DVOA, I think we might be getting a little more respectable. And next week, The Hass comes back.

by jimmimoose on Nov 9, 2008 4:14 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

Mebane

John, I’m sure you’ll break this down later, but wasn’t that Mebane being blown out by the center when Williams busted over left guard for a 51 yard td? I’m not detracting from his overall game, but on that particular play, who is responsible for that gap? And am I mistaken, or was that Russell playing, up giving Ricky a high five on his way to the house?

by Dukeshire on Nov 9, 2008 5:20 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

Also Deon Grant deserves a portion of the blame

He ran across the field to cover the option and left the middle completely open.

by Badical Turbo Radness on Nov 10, 2008 11:10 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

One positive thing I've noticed this season

is almost no fumbles from our RBs especially, or QBs.

by redwolf75 on Nov 9, 2008 6:39 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

Please post that picture

I haven’t watched the replay, thanks for clearing that up. And that was Russell up there. Seems like a good match up, having ’lil Russy on Jake.

by Dukeshire on Nov 9, 2008 6:49 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

as an ND fan

i’m glad to see Carlson doing well. he was really the lone bright spot of an otherwise miserable season last year. he was Brady Quinn’s security blanket in ’06.

sorry the season is going so poorly. it’s too bad a great and classy coach like Holmgren has to go out like this. good luck the rest of the year.

by SBakerTheTouchdownMaker on Nov 10, 2008 5:51 AM PST reply actions   0 recs

First Miami Touchdown

Maybe I’m just conditioned to hate this guy’s play, but didn’t Russell do a great job screening Trufant away from being able to make a play on that flea flicker touchdown pass? Did anyone else think this?

by kokobware on Nov 10, 2008 7:34 AM PST reply actions   0 recs

West Coast 0-12 back East

Since I live in SC, I got the Carolina/Oakland afternoon game on Sunday. They showed a graphic that this season, West Coast teams (including Arizona) are a combined 0-12 when traveling East (coming into Sundays games). By contrast, Eastern teams coming West are 7-7. (Carolina got at least one more win for Eastern teams on Sunday.)

In order to declare this an official problem you’d have to look back over the past several seasons and make some reasonable adjustments for opponent quality. But, it does seem like a real competitive advantage for Eastern teams. Jet lag is a bitch. It just is. It seems to me that a reasonable accommodation that would disadvantage no one would be to start games at 4:15pm in the East that feature a West Coast visitor. I would imagine that from the league’s standpoint they’d get higher ratings for such games out West without so much as inconveniencing the Eastern cities or really threatening the prime time Sunday kickoff.

That seems to make perfect sense to me, and I really can’t see any losers. Of course, it can’t possibly be that simple so what am I missing? Whose toes does this step on?

"Those who fear disorder more than injustice inevitably produce more of both." -- Rev. William Coffin

by dcrockett17 on Nov 10, 2008 7:44 AM PST reply actions   0 recs

How do we make this happen?

petition, protest, old fashioned “sit in.” There is absolutely no reason that this shouldn’t happen. How do we get heard?

by Havik on Nov 10, 2008 9:03 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

This has been studied...

Going back for years and it is – over years and years – a wash. There is no evidence to support that it is harder to go west to east than it is to go east to west. The Western division teams just suck this year.

by Azimeir on Nov 10, 2008 12:49 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

I disagree with this (LOL)

the commentators sure seemed to think it was a problem, and I’ve heard it before.

by djafrot on Nov 10, 2008 1:24 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Not true

It is harder to travel east than it is to travel west. This has been proven.

by Right on Nov 10, 2008 1:35 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

San Fran's dynasty was the exception to the rule

For whatever reason the 49er teams of the Walsh/Seifert era never struggled on the East Coast – they actually dominated – which is maddening to me, since Holmgren was on some of those staffs and I’ve read that he’s tried copying the schedule that Walsh used.

But most studies I’ve seen that show the West-to-East trip is a wash include those 9er teams of their glory years – or include the Broncos who have an extra hour from the mountain time zone and about half the miles to travel . If you take them out, then it becomes much more pronounced.

I agree with drcrockett – IMO the easiest solution is just to make any West-to-East games the late start at 4pm EST. It wouldn’t interfere with the TV schedule, since that’s the same time the West Coast games start. And it wouldn’t create any disadvantage for the East Coast teams, because as it stands now, they already play some late games. It would get every team in the league on the same body-clock schedule. Basically, East Coast teams have never had a game that starts earlier than 1pm their time – they just have to worry about 1pm, 4pm, or 8pm starts. West coast teams have to deal with 10am, 1pm, or 5pm. Eliminate that 10am start for the West, and both coasts are about as equal as you can get.

It would probably help the NFL out as well, because 1pm games usually get better ratings than 10am games on the West Coast. Late starts could lead to higher revenues all the way around.

I’m optimistic that this issue is starting to get attention. It would be pretty easy for the NFL to change – and with all the rumblings that Goodell wants an expanded schedule with the new CBA, it would be a perfect time to implement it.

by jteckmann on Nov 10, 2008 2:20 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

I don't know if the west-to-east thing is anywhere near as meaningful as many seem to think

but speaking strictly as a fan I’d love for those particular games to start at 1 PT. It’s a lot easier for me to catch those games than the ones that start at 10 AM PT.

by BrianL on Nov 10, 2008 5:49 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

The east coast thing is, if not BS, not as pronounced as fans would like:

Seattle’s Record before Sunday:

All Road Games: 49-76 (.392)

East Coast: 15-21 (.416)

Football Outsiders studied it over all teams and couldn’t find any correlation.

by John Morgan on Nov 10, 2008 2:08 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Thanks

You made this point before and was the evidence behind my opinion. Philosphically, I think it’s an excuse to blame losses on where one plays. Back when Denver couldn’t win on artificial turf (and my step-mom was a huge Broncos fan) my solution to her was to make Mile High artificial turf until the players learned to win on it.

by Azimeir on Nov 10, 2008 4:08 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

Okay--didn't know

I wondered about the overall numbers. I’d heard Pat Kirwin on NFL radio say something before game 1 about West Coast teams doing considerably worse on the East Coast going back over several years. He didn’t offer any specifics. But I’m satisfied that the FO study probably means that there isn’t much going on—or at least not enough to make a change in policy to correct for presumed competitive imbalance.

I still think that it’s probably a decent idea to make the West Coast starts in the East kickoff at 4pm based on the prospect of higher TV ratings in the West Coast alone. Generally, scheduling is really difficult to do—lots and lots of factors. However, pushing back the kickoff times for West Coast teams in the East seems like no extra work for anyone.

"Those who fear disorder more than injustice inevitably produce more of both." -- Rev. William Coffin

by dcrockett17 on Nov 10, 2008 6:09 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

I was just wondering; why does it seem that whenever we have a chance to win a blown call by the refs loses it?

I’m not completely blaming it on them-the Seahawks’ dropped passes had more fault-but the phantom hold and horrible OPI call in the Super Bowl; last’s year’s “Moving the ball three yards up on the challenge” call in the GB playoff game; the horrible holding call on Wahle earlier this year on the 51-yard rush by Jones, a call that both Raible and Moon both said shouldn’t have been called; and finally, yesterday’s miss of DPI on that play which had been so crucial. It seems to me that the Seahawks get penalized unfairly much more than any other team and the refs seem to miss more crucial calls against the the Seahawks’ opponents much more than any other team….Or is just because I look for those things?

I'm being owned again!

by Coach Owens on Nov 10, 2008 11:24 AM PST reply actions   0 recs

Everyone notices bad calls more against their own team.

Some Green Bay fan was telling me at the Green Bay game how the Refs were totally in Seattle’s pocket. Not sure how he thought that.

The biggest missed calls, I thought, were the countless times Miami blocked Seahawks players in the back. They’d even show the replays, and the announcers would say “that’s a good block by Ronnie Brown” or whoever it is. No it wasn’t! It was an illegal block. That shit is fucking annoying. You can’t be reading the player’s name on his back as you shove him to the ground.

Yesterday's Pants
A blog-thingy about the Mariners and stuff.

by BrettJMiller on Nov 10, 2008 11:31 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

How I would love to be a referee in pro football.

A referee who actually WASN’T from the south. Ever notice that? That 95% of the referees seem to be from the south?

I'm being owned again!

by Coach Owens on Nov 10, 2008 11:36 AM PST up reply actions   0 recs

I disagree...

I disagree with dropped passes being overrated in importance. If a receiver (TE, RB, etc.) is great at getting open and bad at catching footballs he is a blight to a West Coast offense (and pretty much any offense) which is predicated on short passes designed to get yards after the catch. It’s progressively more important depending on where you are in the scheme of the specific play. If you are the first read and you’re wide open, the QB’s going to throw to you whether other people are open or not. A drop in this case is a play/drive killer. A third or fourth read (outlet RB in the flat, for instance) isn’t as big a deal because at least his drop may be sack prevention.

I also disagree with the baseball error analogy. In baseball you’re right that if the player doesn’t make the play no one would have (usually), but on a football play the next check may also be open (and possessed of better hands).

by Azimeir on Nov 10, 2008 12:59 PM PST reply actions   0 recs

I agree with this (LOL again) to an extent

Especially when Seneca’s in there, because Seneca locks in to the first guy he sees and fires away.

by djafrot on Nov 10, 2008 1:25 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

You're right that a drop is certain fail while a covered receiver allows for another read.

My point wasn’t that dropping the ball is better than being covered, but that drops are just one type of incompletion. It’s no worse than a run of the mill incompletion, ie not escaping coverage and having the ball batted away, running the wrong route and not being where the ball is, lacking separation and getting blown up, etc. It’s only uglier and therefore more frustrating for the fan. In any of the scenarios you describe, substitute any other kind of incompletion and you’re left with the same result. In that sense, drops are “overrated”. They are no more damaging than any other type of incompletion, just like a dropped flyball is no more damaging than if the fielder never reached the ball. And like the sometimes sloppy fielder with good range, I’d rather have a player that can get open but sometimes drops the ball than a player with great hands who can’t get open. The latter represents the great majority of receivers who top out in college like Logan Payne and Mike Hass.

by John Morgan on Nov 10, 2008 2:04 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

However...

I think that you can scheme to get a player open. It’s hard to scheme to make a guy catch a pass thrown to him. In short, I’d rather have Joe Jurevicious (better hands but slower) than Darrell Jackson (lesser hands but faster); they both get open.

I’d also add that drops – like errors – are morale killers; it can also lead to an inexperienced QB to hesitate. One of the things that I’ve always lauded Hasselbeck for is his commitment to his reads – regardless of the drops, he (usually) throws it to the right guy. I’ll always wonder what kind of career he could’ve had with better hands around him considering that 2005 and 2007 were the years with the fewest drops – his career years.

by Azimeir on Nov 10, 2008 4:20 PM PST up reply actions   0 recs

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