Open Thread: College Football Prospect-athon
Five questions:
Who records more sacks, B.J. Raji or Missouri?
Who scores more touchdowns, Tim Tebow or Virginia Tech?
Who records more tackles, Cory Reamer or the Missouri defensive line?
Who records more tackles, Taylor Mays or Kevin Craft?
Who scores more points, Florida or Missouri + Virginia Tech?
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Raji looks impressive, but VT is taking advantage of his aggressiveness
Bender looks real consistent.
Raji looks like a one gap guy
Not impressed with his ability at run stopping. If Seattle selects him, he’s definitely a three.
I'm surprised
how quick Raji is. I didn’t expect him to be a penetrating type of DT but more of a eat up space an blockers guy. He and Bane would look solid next to each other.
Raji has shown
a variety of moves also. Nice spin move and strong bull rush. He’s not bad with his hands either and showed a decent swim. He just doesn’t seem to anchor that well but I’ve only watched him for one half so I shouldn’t be too critical on that yet.
Doesn't anchor
but it’s hard to know what is asked of him. Agreed on the moves, though I saw one spin that was laughably slow. I think he needs a little work on conditioning. He looks gassed on some plays. If he plays alongside Mebane, he should see plenty of single blocks.
Where do you see Raji going in the draft?
I’d think round 2-3. He seems equivalent to Trevor Laws.
Geno Atkins probably won't come out this year.
I’m about 90% sure on this, but I don’t think he’s gotten a sack all year long, after getting 7.5 last year. It’d be a moronic move to declare.
by SeaTownBlueDevil on Dec 6, 2008 11:57 AM PST up reply actions
I would put him in the Top 5 for DTs
Behind Terrence Cody (who said he’s not leaving early), Sen’Derrick Marks (that’s not a real name), and maybe Demarcus Granger or Peria Jerry.
Depending on how desired DTs are, my guess is late second round.
by SeaTownBlueDevil on Dec 6, 2008 11:54 AM PST up reply actions
My picks
1) BJ Raji
2) Virginia Tech
3) Missouri D-line
4) Taylor Mays
5) Missouri + Virginia Tech
by SeaTownBlueDevil on Dec 6, 2008 11:58 AM PST reply actions
Virginia Tech makes for a frustrating matchup
from a scouting standpoint.
Note: Raji weak against the option and quarterback draws.
Man, I think Tebow will be a good QB.
If he drops at all, I think I wouldn’t mind trading up to get him.
Where do you think he’d go if he went out this year?
I think he'd be a mid- to late-first round pick
But I’m guessing he’s one of those players that a team either really wants or really doesn’t want, which means that a QB-desperate team might take him around the 8-15 range or a few teams might pass on him and he lasts to the end of the first, maybe even early second round. With the success of Matt Ryan and Joe Flacco, I’d bet he goes earlier than that. Personally, I’m one of those guys that doesn’t want him. It would be interesting to see if we’d trade up for him from the early second to the late first if he were to take a Rodgers/Quinn type fall, which wouldn’t be all that surprising given Urban Meyer’s last highly drafted QB Alex Smith.
by SeaTownBlueDevil on Dec 6, 2008 1:34 PM PST up reply actions
He couldn't be in a less pro style offense
He’s a huge risk and people overestimate his upside. He’s not real fast and NFL linebackers would break him in two. I have zero interest in Tebow. He gets the credit because he’s the face, but Tebow is part of a juggernaut offense and an innovative offense.
Yeah, I know, it's impossible to judge how good he'd be in a pro offense.
But I just see big size, good arm, and I just assume he can make smart decision.
I don't know.
He is not overly accurate, throws wobbly deep balls, and gets a lot of help from YAC
Can't wait for Ruskell to knock this one out of the park.
His arm is awful
he gets a lot of help from his supporting cast.
Tebow does not have NFL QB skills.
You know what? Fuck you Sports Gods, fuck you.
Interesting that you say that...
I havent been very impressed with Smith at all. He’s getting smoked by the speed rush- bends at his waist and seems to have to reach for rushers. He’s been prety good in run blocking, particularly sealing his man off, but I have yet to see him dominate his man. In fact, he just got owned by the Mike on Florida.
I really like Bama’s center though. Guy is straight up beastly.
And what an arm on Park Wilson
I haven't been too impressed either
Good hand tech, blah athleticism, not great in space; looks like slower, bulkier Jammal Brown.
Have you seen anything from Oher?
He looks pretty spry in his YouTube highlights.
I've saved myself for Oher
Right now, I consider this fun. Heck, I’m drinking beer as I watch this next game. Come January, I’m going to treat it seriously. I’ll tackle Oher then.
Just curious
You’re asking who will have more tackles, Taylor Mays, the All American safety, or Kevin Craft, the quarterback?
I dont know if you noticed
but ASU had 4 defensive TD’s against UCLA, 3 coming on pick 6’s by Craft. He will get his opportunities
Can't wait for Ruskell to knock this one out of the park.
I dont know if you know
but when the defense scores a touchdown, the offense generally doesn’t record a tackle.
The point of the comment was not that craft was an impressive tackler
but rather that he had plenty of opportunities. You’re just being obtuse at this point.
Can't wait for Ruskell to knock this one out of the park.
Ugh... so it looks like Crabtree isn't going to declare.
This draft scares me…
We probably wouldn't have gone after him anyway
Saves us from playing against him
Dick Dastardly and Muttley with sick laughter
by Wayward Llama on Dec 6, 2008 4:50 PM PST up reply actions
Hopefully that thing that plays nosetackle for Alabama.
You know you want him, Kansas City.
Dick Dastardly and Muttley with sick laughter
by Wayward Llama on Dec 6, 2008 4:57 PM PST up reply actions
I'm sure this will be a blowout
I just want to watch the quarterbacks. Daniels should get plenty of opportunities.
Okay...
as a Mizzou alum, if you hear me crying please comfort me.
"Those who fear disorder more than injustice inevitably produce more of both." -- Rev. William Coffin
yup
our ahem… D hasn’t forced TOs. That’s the big difference from last year.
"Those who fear disorder more than injustice inevitably produce more of both." -- Rev. William Coffin
Here's the vexing thing
OU’s line looks like someone popped the 1992 Dallas Cowboys front five onto a college program. How can you judge the skill position players?
Speaking of constant pressure
I only saw a little of the SEC championship, but Florida was all over Wilson. Any names on their d-line to keep an eye on?
They really didn't get close
until late in the game. Wilson was free most of the day.
Thing is, you gotta score 30+ to beat FLA—period. ‘Bama can’t do that.
"Those who fear disorder more than injustice inevitably produce more of both." -- Rev. William Coffin
yup
and opens rush lanes.
"Those who fear disorder more than injustice inevitably produce more of both." -- Rev. William Coffin
I don't know how much I buy into the height issue with Daniels
Are his lineman that much smaller in college than what he’ll be throwing over in the NFL?
I'm super skeptical about height
Especially as an avowed fan of Doug Flutie, but having the linemen play so far apart would improve sight lines.
punch thrown?
"Those who fear disorder more than injustice inevitably produce more of both." -- Rev. William Coffin
overmatched up front
i still don’t think OU’s skill position players are any better than ours.
"Those who fear disorder more than injustice inevitably produce more of both." -- Rev. William Coffin
but up front
OU is a bitch… every year.
"Those who fear disorder more than injustice inevitably produce more of both." -- Rev. William Coffin
According to Wiki Shotgun is setting up at least 5 yards behind center
Chase does look a bit further back.
Nope
I think it’s the deepest shotgun you’ll find, along with Texas Tech.
"Those who fear disorder more than injustice inevitably produce more of both." -- Rev. William Coffin
both
he has to run in this game, but he hates to step up in the pocket; looks panicky
"Those who fear disorder more than injustice inevitably produce more of both." -- Rev. William Coffin
absolutely
Daniels is a pretty good runner, but OU has had so much success with him personally because the front four has always been able to handle him. That doesn’t happen too much.
Still, stepping up in the pocket seems to not be second nature to him. I was thinking that last week looking at the difference between he and Todd Reesing. Reesing steps up into the pocket more intuitively. Daniel’s instinct is to fade backwards.
"Those who fear disorder more than injustice inevitably produce more of both." -- Rev. William Coffin
Reesing has a noodle arm
Is it an issue with making multiple reads for Daniels or is he just confident enough in his legs to tuck it and run?
probably the latter
he’s been running this offense since the 8th grade
"Those who fear disorder more than injustice inevitably produce more of both." -- Rev. William Coffin
That's the monster difference in the spread
and a pro-style—having to step up into the pocket. That’s where the height is the problem; not completing throws, but with cutting down on field vision. When Daniels steps up he gets swallowed up by the linemen.
"Those who fear disorder more than injustice inevitably produce more of both." -- Rev. William Coffin
he can make the big boy throws
"Those who fear disorder more than injustice inevitably produce more of both." -- Rev. William Coffin
That play was a pretty clear indicator of the talent difference between these teams
a really well excuted screen that went for nothing.
except for maclin
"Those who fear disorder more than injustice inevitably produce more of both." -- Rev. William Coffin
had he gone to OU
(he committed there) it would have just been completely unfair.
"Those who fear disorder more than injustice inevitably produce more of both." -- Rev. William Coffin
Thats too bad
if he declared we wouldn’t have to hope that no one would trade up to get bradford before us
frick
"Those who fear disorder more than injustice inevitably produce more of both." -- Rev. William Coffin
Okay, seriously...
the officials are getting out of hand now. This game has been relatively clean. There’s some yapping, but not much else.
Nobody paid to see the officials. This game isn’t close to getting out of hand. They could chill out.
"Those who fear disorder more than injustice inevitably produce more of both." -- Rev. William Coffin
Christensen is a great OC
but he’s a bit like Martz in that he’s one of these guys who will call any play in any situation.
"Those who fear disorder more than injustice inevitably produce more of both." -- Rev. William Coffin
Seems odd to blame Daniel for that fumble
at least from a scouting standpoint. It’s just such an odd play. Just watching Daniel square with the linebacker I didn’t see a positive outcome for Mizzou.
yeah, but...
Ball security is football 101. Hit the ground. Love Chase, but the offense is all about him. He has to hold on to the ball.
"Those who fear disorder more than injustice inevitably produce more of both." -- Rev. William Coffin
In his defense...
Chase Coffman is his security blanket. He has turf toe. He’s been hurt in two straight Big12 title games. Sucks for us.
I think that accounts for at least some of the oddball playcalling, but Christiansen is an odd playcaller.
"Those who fear disorder more than injustice inevitably produce more of both." -- Rev. William Coffin
My critique is that he hasn't adjusted his calling to his opponent
I don’t see how you call a designed quarterback run against a superior linebacker corps—
Damn, another strike by Bradford.
Yeah, that's my point
He’s one of these guys that doesn’t really do matchups. He just runs plays.
It’s really vexing sometimes.
"Those who fear disorder more than injustice inevitably produce more of both." -- Rev. William Coffin
Don't think that was ever a question
It was all about whether we’d show up offensively, and that hasn’t happened.
"Those who fear disorder more than injustice inevitably produce more of both." -- Rev. William Coffin
He had a 4 pick game vs Colorado in like his 4th or 5th start
I don’t think he’s made a big mistake since then.
"Those who fear disorder more than injustice inevitably produce more of both." -- Rev. William Coffin
Daniel can't find an open man
They’re dropping seven every play, but he should still be able to find someone.
I don't know
I’ve been watching a lot of QB’s lately and I’m leaning more and more towards getting a top flight OT. Elite tackles just don’t drop in the draft and successful quarterbacks can be found in the mid rounds pretty regularly. Bradford certainly looks awesome but just from a value standpoint I don’t know that I could justify it.
It's interesting that you say that
I compiled this the other day for a post that didn’t pan out. It’s pretty first round heavy, and that’s missing a few stars.
Warner: 6’2" Undrafted 33.3%
Ryan: 6046 1st 34.3%
Flacco: 6063 1st -0.5%
Edwards: 6041 3rd 1.1%
Delhomme: 6’2" Undrafted 9.0%
Orton: 6040 4th 12.3%
Fitzpatrick: 6023 7th -22.1%
Anderson: 6061 6th -10.4%
Romo: 6020 Undrafted 28.3%
Cutler: 6032 1st 24.8%
Culpepper: 6’4" 1st -46.7%
Rodgers: 6020 1st 12.8%
Rosenfels: 6043 4th 5.5%
Manning: 6’5" 1st 25.9%
Garrard: 6017 4th 8.7%
Thigpen: 6017 7th -8.2%
Pennington: 6033 1st 26.2%
Frerotte: 6’3" 7th -4.0%
Cassel: 6’4" 7th 1.4%
Brees: 6002 2nd 36.4%
E. Manning: 6046 1st 23.9%
Favre: 6’2" 2nd 9.8%
Russell: 6054 1st -22.5%
McNabb: 6022 1st 8.6%
Roethlisberger: 6047 1st -5.0%
Rivers: 6050 1st 32.7%
Hill: 6030 Undrafted 2.1%
Hasselbeck: 6040 6th -39.6%
Bulger: 6015 6th -25.6%
Garcia: 5’11" Undrafted 18.6%
Collins: 6’5" 1st 19.7%
Campbell: 6046 1st 10.7%
1st: 14
2nd: 2
3rd: 1
4th: 3
5th: 0
6th: 3
7th: 4
Undrafted: 5
What would that list look like for OT's?
The reasoning behind my wanting to draft an o-lineman high is their low bust factor (flexibility to move them around on the line) and the idea that the quality drop from round to round on tackles is higher than the drop with QB’s.
Well the pool would then be 64
If we’re talking just left tackles, I would guess it would be more even. Some great lines don’t have top left tackles: Giants, Tampa Bay, Dallas, Arizona, Indianapolis…I think maybe the importance of left tackle is overstated. You need someone good, but it seems like overall offensive line talent is much more important. I’ll look into that.
When the SEC stops paying the bills
CBS just straight shills for them
"Those who fear disorder more than injustice inevitably produce more of both." -- Rev. William Coffin
Really?
I think no matter what he does in the Senior Bowl that’s where he’s gonna be drafted. I kinda think he oughta hope not to get drafted, and try to find the right situation for him as a FA.
"Those who fear disorder more than injustice inevitably produce more of both." -- Rev. William Coffin
His stats are crazy good
and not for some fringe school. His upside is sufficient a small handful of teams could push him up, but he needs to show he can play in a pro system. Scouts have to recognize he’s excelled for three straight years and without a ton of pro talent.
Daniels seems like someone that would benefit from the senior bowl
matching him with similarly talent players should help him a lot. Oklahoma is a fabulously talent team, Mizzou is Chase Daniels.
Not so fast
Will Franklin
Martin Rucker
Chase Coffman
Jeremy Maclin
All those guys are, or will play on Sundays. He’s had more pro talent than most college QBs. Had Denario Alexander not blown out both knees he’d probably be another pro.
Daniels has traits that translate to the league, but probably not if you run a classic dropback-style offense. You’ll have to do something different than that for Daniels to work.
The thing, Nate, is that Gary Pinkel has chosen to make Mizzou all Daniels all the time. The RB, Derrick Washington is a top 5 back in the conference, maybe the 3rd best. We know Maclin and Coffman is 1st team All-American. The ask Daniel to do too much in my opinion.
"Those who fear disorder more than injustice inevitably produce more of both." -- Rev. William Coffin
I think a great line is a quarterback's best friend
Obviously, Daniel is benefiting from guys getting open and run after catch, but OU is getting great rush with three down linemen. It’s hard to know what Daniels would do if he had a second to scan the field.
Additionally
Down and distance. Bradford is always playing from great down and distances, while Daniels is always swimming in third and long. Good research suggest turnovers are the product of losing rather than the cause of it.
Anyway, this is just talk. I hope to have a better idea what I’m talking about soon enough.
The down and distance issue
gets back to offensive philosophy (and this year, depth at WR).
As for the offensive line, I suppose you’re not going to compete with the elite programs with 4 of 5 starters from not-exactly-football factories in small town Missouri.
"Those who fear disorder more than injustice inevitably produce more of both." -- Rev. William Coffin
I watched that game and I didn't think Tebow was so impressive
Hard to credit a guy for shovel passes. Tebow is fun, but it seems like commentators attribute every offensive success to Tebow and I don’t see it.
Yup.
"Those who fear disorder more than injustice inevitably produce more of both." -- Rev. William Coffin
Arizona vs Arizona State
Fortunately, my other alma mater is playing tonight: Arizona. The tight end, Gronkowski, is a pretty good player.
Speaking of late round QBs, Rudy Carpenter of ASU is a guy who has some talent but had a program fall apart around him. He’s got some tools.
"Those who fear disorder more than injustice inevitably produce more of both." -- Rev. William Coffin
Speaking of Arizona
They need to get a new coach
Not in this economy
Stoops isn’t bad. This is his first job. I’d say the program is progressing.
"Those who fear disorder more than injustice inevitably produce more of both." -- Rev. William Coffin
He won't make anyone forget...
Bill Walsh, but John Mackovic was the WORST coach in college football. Now, if it were me, I’d have hired Norm Chow. But short of that, Stoops was about the best hire we could have made.
"Those who fear disorder more than injustice inevitably produce more of both." -- Rev. William Coffin
So this game is a bust
I figured it would be lopsided, but I didn’t foresee the lack of scoring from Missouri.
Once again...
Ed Venables has made Dave Christiansen his bitch.
Uggh.
Sigh.
"Those who fear disorder more than injustice inevitably produce more of both." -- Rev. William Coffin
Pinkel has recruited well
They’re still a bowl team without him. He’s probably worth about 2 wins.
Actually, looking up
Blaine Gabbert was rated the top pro-style QB in the nation. He’s played a bit this year in some blowouts. I actually don’t feel bad going forward.
The question is about getting more athletes up front. Missouri produces very good skill players; not many big boys.
"Those who fear disorder more than injustice inevitably produce more of both." -- Rev. William Coffin
Nobody's peak is as high as their's
over the past three seasons. Remember, two seasons ago you had Adrian Peterson on this team. When they’re right, nobody hangs with them. I include Florida in that.
BUT, OU seems to need some controversy or some sort of story to play at their absolute best. They come out flat in big games. They weren’t flat against Boise State. That was just a great game they happened to lose. But they came out flat against WVU last year. They played Rodriguez’s spread the same way they played Mizzou, and got blistered.
"Those who fear disorder more than injustice inevitably produce more of both." -- Rev. William Coffin
It seems college is 9/10 recruiting, 1/10 coaching
But if you ignore it, that 1/10 will find a way to bite you every season.
I'd pick USC over every team in the nation (minus Florida)
but they won’t even get a chance. It’s an unfair system, but it’s exciting.
And recruiting takes so long
Missouri is totally on the right track, but you gotta take a whole lotta medicine to get where OU is.
"Those who fear disorder more than injustice inevitably produce more of both." -- Rev. William Coffin
They won't overturn it
but that Maclin is a tough kid.
"Those who fear disorder more than injustice inevitably produce more of both." -- Rev. William Coffin
How on earth do you not challenge that?
He had it all the way down and then dropped it when he was on his back.
I really root for Daniel
He’s a true underdog. I think he will fight himself into being a pro on some level. Just a hard worker and a fighter.
Yeah,
he doesn’t drop anything does he?
"Those who fear disorder more than injustice inevitably produce more of both." -- Rev. William Coffin
At least Arizona won
I can put the sleeping pills and grain alcohol down.
"Those who fear disorder more than injustice inevitably produce more of both." -- Rev. William Coffin
The very last home game...
of my senior year OU beat us 61-0.
I suppose this is progress.
"Those who fear disorder more than injustice inevitably produce more of both." -- Rev. William Coffin
What are your thoughts on Percy Harvin?
I always notice he makes a few big plays in most of the Gators games…
He’s just a junior who is unlikely to declare though isn’t he?
I don’t know much about him, and I’m not even sure he’s a fit for the Seahawks, but he’s definitely fun to watch.
Yesterday's Pants
A blog-thingy about the Mariners and stuff.
He'll probably declare
He’s a first round talent, and he’s already got a National Championship so he’s got no real reason to stay. He gets injured, a lot, and that’s the only real knock on him, but it’s never major injuries, so nothing that will linger through his career. The best receiver and runningback on his team, he’s a guy who’ll cause an offensive coordinator to rework his playbook to get him as many touches as possible, running and catching (a la Reggie Bush).
That being said, he’d be a reach for where the Hawks will be picking, and probably won’t slide far enough to be taken in the second round. Without trading picks, Harvin will not be wearing a Seattle uni next year.
Which sucks.
Not a single Gator plays for the Seahawks. =(
Dick Dastardly and Muttley with sick laughter
by Wayward Llama on Dec 7, 2008 1:50 PM PST up reply actions

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