Seahawks Hire Greg Knapp as OC
by Doug Farrar on Jan 7, 2009 1:07 PM PST
65 comments
Per Adam Schefter. This was about as surprising as ... well, something not very surprising. I'm off to e-mail a buddy of mine who has covered the 49ers for years with some intel. Be back with that by the end of the day.
Update by John Morgan: A few quick reactions for now. Tomorrow, I'll start a week and a half look at the Greg Knapp playbook.
- Knapp shoots for a 50+ percentage of run plays. To do that, he spreads carries between two or ideally three backs. Justin Forsett lovers could see Force seeing regular carries. I would expect Seattle to pursue a running back this offseason.
- Knapp does not run with his fullback. Justin Griffith, who followed Knapp to Oakland, has never recorded even twenty carries in his five seasons playing under Knapp. That's deceptively high, the mode for Griffith's carries per game is zero. Griffith received most of his carries substituting at running back.
- That means Leonard Weaver is either on his way out, in line to be transitioned to running back, or about to get a whole lot less valuable.
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Hm... I just read that the Hawks were considering Jago
since he coached Hasselbeck or worked with him, and also worked with Mora
http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/news/story?id=3816644
Oh well.
by LantermanC on Jan 7, 2009 1:13 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
The Jets may have pounced on him.
Knapp seemed like a fait accompli;
by Doug Farrar on Jan 7, 2009 1:18 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
Do the Jets even run the WCO?
Also why did the Raiders have him? JaMarcus doesn’t really seem like a WCO kind of guy…
by LantermanC on Jan 7, 2009 1:20 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Are you trying to make sense out of Al Davis decision?
Good luck with that one.
"Hey, guess what? Nobody cares who would win in a crazy fantasy fist-fight between Anne Frank and Lizzie Borden." The Monarch
by crushedoptimist on Jan 7, 2009 1:22 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
I'm fairly pleased with this development...
Knapp did a pretty decent job with Atlanta, being able to create a somewhat new offense on the fly to fit Michael Vick’s tendencies. He loves the Tight End position (see: Alge Crumpler), and we already have a decent fit there. He also didn’t need #1 WR talent to move the ball effectively. We’ll see what his offense looks like, but apart from the “Tampa 2” discussion we’re having on defense, it appears to match the skillset of the talent already on the Seahawks team.
"Hey, guess what? Nobody cares who would win in a crazy fantasy fist-fight between Anne Frank and Lizzie Borden." The Monarch
by crushedoptimist on Jan 7, 2009 1:20 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
All great points CO.
I fully expected JC to be one of the top 10 TEs next year, and with Knapp it looks as though we will make full use of his skills.
Same goes for the WR comment, though it is hard to tell if that caused Roddy White to not be as good (hard to tell with Vick, and White was only a rookie or 2nd year player).
by LantermanC on Jan 7, 2009 1:22 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
It's somewhat difficult to grade any WR during the Vick years
It’s not like they would ever actually get a well-thrown, well-placed ball thrown in their direction.
"Hey, guess what? Nobody cares who would win in a crazy fantasy fist-fight between Anne Frank and Lizzie Borden." The Monarch
by crushedoptimist on Jan 7, 2009 1:24 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
you COULD evaluate their downfield blocking and ability to internalize frustration.
I DRINK YOUR MILKSHAKE!!! I DRINK IT UP!!
by abender20 on Jan 7, 2009 1:52 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
You mean AGAIN next year?
JC was the 9th ranked TE in 2008:
I think he could break the top-5 as guys like Gates and Clark all seem to increasingly miss time. Gonzo isn’t getting any younger, either. It seems the Knapp/Mora system will benefit Carlson, which is exciting.
by Misfit74 on Jan 7, 2009 3:34 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Good point.
Actually I wrote 5 at first, then I put in 10, but though ‘I wonder if he was already top 10…’. I could definitely see him being the top tight end over the next 5 years.
by LantermanC on Jan 7, 2009 4:08 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
I am curious to find out his DYAR, etc. When does PFP '09 come out?
That is simply a yardage ranking. He ranked 7th among TEs in touchdowns.
by Misfit74 on Jan 7, 2009 4:21 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
When the Seahawks drafted John Carlson...
…my first throught was, “Eric Johnson”. And I ain’t talkin’ about the guitarist, or the “Eric’s Little Heroes” guy.
by Doug Farrar on Jan 7, 2009 1:22 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
Eric Johnson was a terrific TE for a few years there
Hopefully Carlson doesn’t have the injury issues though.
"Hey, guess what? Nobody cares who would win in a crazy fantasy fist-fight between Anne Frank and Lizzie Borden." The Monarch
by crushedoptimist on Jan 7, 2009 1:27 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
8 years as OC, he's never been out of top 10 in rushing
granted, the 3 with Atl include Vick freak show. But with Matt’s health issues, not having him drop back 30+ times a game is a good thing.
by Dukeshire on Jan 7, 2009 1:55 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
The Raiders were top 10?
weird since they were behind so often, you figured they’d pass it a lot. Also weird since McFadden sucked, though the AFC West run defense was pretty horrible this year.
by LantermanC on Jan 7, 2009 1:57 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
I for one am shocked
SHOCKED at this hiring.
by John Morgan on Jan 7, 2009 2:25 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
it does seem premature, but the speculation had been somewhat rampant
by Misfit74 on Jan 7, 2009 3:36 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Speculation by mean it would seem.
Ruskell’s administration has been nothing if not predictable.
by John Morgan on Jan 7, 2009 3:56 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Nice, let the offseason begin.
I just hope they’re not planning on making Seattle’s offense like Atlanta’s with VIck, except with Seneca at the helm. Scary.
It's great to be a Florida Gator!
by Wayward Llama on Jan 7, 2009 2:25 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
I expect the offense to look more like the Mariucci/Steve Young 49ers than the Vick Falcons.
by MFAN on Jan 7, 2009 2:34 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
works for me
those were some good offenses from what I remember. With Knapp at the helm will there be less of a 2 year learning curve for wide receivers to do anything?
by Hancock.Brett on Jan 7, 2009 2:48 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
nice idea. of course, we'd have to have some rookies drafted before the 6th round, by most accounts...
by Misfit74 on Jan 7, 2009 3:37 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
ATL drafted 1st round WRs back-to-back
Michael Jenkins in ‘04 & Roddy White in ’05 the first years Mora/Knapp were there. So there’s a little bit of evidence they like top talent at the position.
by jteckmann on Jan 7, 2009 3:53 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
that could be just that ticket to Crabtree, if that is determined to be the best move... :) exciting.
by Misfit74 on Jan 7, 2009 4:08 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
white
certainly turned out OK once he got an excellent QB throwing to him. Crabtree here we come!
by Hancock.Brett on Jan 7, 2009 4:47 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
So did Jenkins.
At least 50-777-3 is solid for a secondary target. Didn’t know you posted here Brett, its Ryan.
by vanrijn on Jan 8, 2009 11:24 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
As for John's update...
Perhaps he didn’t run the fullback because he loved that guy as a blocker so much? I think the best coaches adapt their system to the players they currently have, not the other way around (unless they’ve been there for a while, in which case, their players are already there).
How many catches do his full backs get? This is where I think Weaver is at his best, a few runs per game, and a few short passes like the SF game (obviously best case scenario).
I kind of do hope we draft a RB in the middle rounds, but it seems we are still too crowded there. Any chance we cut one of our RBs?
by LantermanC on Jan 7, 2009 4:12 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
I think the loss of Morris to FA will be enough to add one
by Misfit74 on Jan 7, 2009 4:17 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
I suppose, but we seemed of crowded before.
Hence the cutting of Forsett. Duckett was barely used as well.
1. JJ
2. rookie RB
3. Duckett
4. Forsett
5. Weaver
6. Schmitt
I’d almost rather just give Weaver some more looks at HB, though I guess one would make a good point that if JJ goes down, it kind of screws us up.
by LantermanC on Jan 7, 2009 4:20 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Duckett and JJ are front-loaded in their contracts so it wouldn't cost us too much to cut them if Weaver, Forsett, or a rookie were to step up.
by SeaTownBlueDevil on Jan 7, 2009 4:33 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
I would still like to see a Schmitt/Weaver backfield.
It's great to be a Florida Gator!
by Wayward Llama on Jan 7, 2009 4:37 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
If Knapp's not big on fullbacks, we may lose Weaver altogether
and thus necessitate bringing in a vet FB, which I don’t mind.
I think JJ/Forsett/Duckett is a good enough RB triumvirate (hope that word means what I think it means).
by djafrot on Jan 7, 2009 4:42 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Why dump Weaver just to bring it someone else?
That makes no sense.
It's great to be a Florida Gator!
by Wayward Llama on Jan 7, 2009 4:58 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
because Weaver's not really that much of a blocker
He can catch and run, but if the most important characteristic of a Knapp FB is run blocking, he’s not going to be very useful.
by djafrot on Jan 7, 2009 5:21 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
yeah, certainly, at some point
But is he ready to start right now? It doesn’t really hurt us to pick up a veteran FA FB and give Schmitt time to play special teams and pick up the nuances of the game. We’ll carry two fullbacks anyhow.
by djafrot on Jan 7, 2009 5:37 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
I'd say he's ready to start now.
We should just keep Weaver. I like him too much to just lose him for nothing. I feel like he’ll go to another team and get some playing time and get 500 500 or something.
by LantermanC on Jan 7, 2009 5:55 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Weaver's been counted out before
and come back strong at each instance. I think he’ll be on the 53 and get touches. He’s a decent receiver, so maybe an H-back kind of role?
by lemonverbena on Jan 7, 2009 11:18 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Duckett maybe, but not Jones.
IIRC, we’d have to eat about $3M dead cap to cut Jones after just one season. Duckett’s interesting – he’s due a $2M roster bonus in March. His production under Holmgren in ‘08 doesn’t merit it, but his history with Mora/Knapp indicates they know/are willing how to use him better.
IMO, both guys stick in ’09, and we see a more even split of carries between the two – going to a smash & dash running attack. Forsett probably sees an increased role as a change-of-pace guy.
Weaver’s the wild card, and will depend on what other teams offer him in FA. If Knapp is flexible, I can see Weaver sicking around – with less carries, but an important target in the passing game, and used as the occasional 3rd down Back. If Knapp just wants a bruising blocker to pave the way for his RBBC, then I see them letting Weaver walk and the Owen Schmitt era beginning.
I don’t see us adding an RB in the draft this year. Maybe they’ll think about it in ‘10 if the attack doesn’t click this coming year.
by jteckmann on Jan 7, 2009 5:06 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
The thing with contract is...
Duckett can always be asked to restructure. His value in a Mora/Knapp regime is probably higher than anywhere else. I don’t think they just let Weaver walk, but they won’t break the bank for him either. My suspicion is that plan would be to have Schmidt start at FB while Weaver would split time at tailback — we run a lot more split back sets — and fullback. (Of course, the off-season, OTAs, and training camp will probably dictate what happens.) Weaver is adequate as a run blocker, but he’s excellent all-around in the passing game. I don’t think you just let that walk out the door, particularly at a position that is so highly volatile and susceptible to injury.
I won’t be surprised if another team steps in and makes him an offer to split time with another player. For example, I could see Tampa having an interest.
"Those who fear disorder more than injustice inevitably produce more of both." -- Rev. William Coffin
by dcrockett17 on Jan 8, 2009 7:56 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Hopefully
This means we’ll get some better running plays. The WCO is good but it is kind of predictable now. Its probably mostly our offensive line but if we can get some new running plays Id like to see what we can do. There has to be some reason that the Raiders can run the ball even know they have a mediocre offensive line like the Seahawks.
by Seahawks CHS on Jan 7, 2009 5:08 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
We still will be running the WCO
You may gain some yards on the ground, but eventually Lofa will end up biting you in the ass.
by Scruffy Lefty on Jan 7, 2009 5:32 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
yah, but it will be different.
It says that Knapp has run 50% pass/run… sounds like he’s pretty dedicated to the run game, which is different from Holmgren.
by djafrot on Jan 7, 2009 5:38 PM PST up reply actions 0 recs
yawn
someone wake me when theres news s
You may gain some yards on the ground, but eventually Lofa will end up biting you in the ass.
by Scruffy Lefty on Jan 7, 2009 5:32 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
What a shocker.
I’m speechless right now.
by Fearless Frog on Jan 7, 2009 5:36 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
I think Weaver is safe
He will probably be resigned and it won’t cost a ton. He has never put up the sort of numbers to really get onto other teams’ radars. He also doesn’t have the measurable speed/power combine hype following him around for his whole career. He is a hometown favorite type of guy. We have seen him make a lot of big plays, but he has never been cast in the sort of role he would need to be playing to get a lot of money playing anywhere. I don’t see any team bringing him in as more than a third string halfback. He isn’t a super tantalizing fullback option either..
Considering the free agent (or otherwise available) RB class: Sproles, LJ, Edge, Jacobs, Ward, Rhodes, Morris, Ricky Williams, Evans I just don’t see retaining Weaver as a very costly proposition.
I think weaver makes a lot of sense as a 3rd down back. He is very good pass blocker as well as receiver. I guess we’ll see.
Big news, the OC signing. Remember, Knapp will be calling the plays almost certainly now that we no longer have a HC doing that.
by michaelfox99 on Jan 8, 2009 4:54 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
Weaver's a Pro Bowl alternate
And it was probably other coaches/players that voted him in, not fans. He’s not a superstar, but he’s no longer just our little secret tucked away up here.
The good news (for us) is that even the best FBs don’t get paid a ton of coin relative to other positions. But then again, every dollar against the cap counts. So if having a receiving/running threat at FB is not a priority for Knapp, then it’s hard to justify spending it. But I pretty confident that teams that do use multi-threat FB’s definitely have Weaver on their radar at this point.
by jteckmann on Jan 8, 2009 8:48 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah
Weaver has an intriguing suite of skills that make him pretty valuable in real football the same way he sucks in Madden. As an OC I could see lining up Weaves as a FB, HB, 2nd or 3rd TE, or slot back depending on the situation and formation.
by Azimeir on Jan 8, 2009 9:46 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Not for me
Considering his long runs and TDs both receiving and running, he at least has the speed of a slow HB, which is the speed of a dominant FB in Madden. Great hands, great tackler-breaker…he’s a madden monster. ;) At least when I “correct” his attributes.
by cashless on Jan 8, 2009 10:02 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Weaver was the first FB since around 40 years ago to have over 100+ receiving yards and 2 TDs.
Obviously, he isn’t a hyped up back to the tune of LT, but he’s almost certainly on some coach’s radars, especially because he is ridiculously versatile and we haven’t even touched the scope of what he can do.
by Fearless Frog on Jan 8, 2009 11:22 AM PST up reply actions 0 recs
Weaver
Does this mean the end to the third and 9 fullback draw play? I shed a tear…boo-hoo. Not really. Weaver was a Pro Bowl alternate because he posted some offensive numbers. Most fullbacks are asked to block first, block second, block third, etc. Doesn’t mean he’s the second best blocking FB in the conference.
by Section 128 on Jan 8, 2009 9:11 AM PST reply actions 0 recs
Forsett
I think you guys are getting way ahead of yourself with Forsett. I mean I have a man crush on him too, but when was the last time that he recorded a regular season carry. No, I’m actually curious. Did he receive any carries this season?
I would like to see him be our third down/change of pace Darren Sproles/Derrick Ward kind of back. But I’m not ready to inaugurate him yet.
by Havik on Jan 8, 2009 1:34 PM PST reply actions 0 recs
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