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Around SBN: How A Letter From Tom Coughlin Helped One Fan's Recovery

This may simply be "creating" news rather than "reporting" news. This rumor will not go away until Paul Allen makes a decision on our leaderships future.

In my opinion, I just want exciting football. That is my GM choice; a guy that brings excitment.

over 2 years ago Beauchesne-trophy0503_tiny kidder95 47 comments 0 recs  | 

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Q&A With Trevor Laws

Apr 2008 by John Morgan - 19 comments

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not even clicking on the link.

by John Morgan on Oct 26, 2009 2:58 PM PDT reply actions  

Awesome.

Even if we don’t hire Holmgren (or any other GM for that matter) and keep Ruskell, at least Tim will know he shouldn’t take his job for granted and Allen is at least considering others because of how dreadful we’ve been the last two seasons.

"Mayhap a hidden door lurks nigh. Let us search the environs."

by Fearless Frog on Oct 26, 2009 3:04 PM PDT reply actions  

I think its a bad idea

Like trying to get back together with an ex-girlfriend while she’s got a new boyfriend. Its just too soon for Holmgren to come back as a GM to Seattle.

"Its not that I can't read and write, its just that I don't like to read and write."
-Charlie

by ninjasocks on Oct 26, 2009 4:48 PM PDT reply actions  

Wait, who's the lesbian lover in this analogy?

Cause every love triangle needs a hot lesbian.

Bird Law in this country isn't governed by reason.

by Tyler Jorgensen on Oct 27, 2009 2:06 PM PDT up reply actions   1 recs

Gruden

He kinda looks like a lesbian, if you squint your eyes a bit.

"Its not that I can't read and write, its just that I don't like to read and write."
-Charlie

by ninjasocks on Oct 27, 2009 4:06 PM PDT up reply actions   1 recs

I much prefer the lipstick kind...

to the Grudenesque.

Bird Law in this country isn't governed by reason.

by Tyler Jorgensen on Oct 27, 2009 5:38 PM PDT up reply actions  

He proposed to his wife when he was 15?

That makes me question his decision making skills.

by LantermanC on Oct 26, 2009 4:49 PM PDT reply actions  

He traded Joey Galloway for 2 first round picks.

Drafted Hutch, Shaun, and traded for Matt. All good in my book!

"Mayhap a hidden door lurks nigh. Let us search the environs."

by Fearless Frog on Oct 26, 2009 5:45 PM PDT up reply actions  

And he also drafted

1999
1 Lamar King Saginaw Valley State
3 Brock Huard Washington
3 Karsten Bailey Auburn
4 Antonio Cochran Georgia
5 Floyd Wedderburn Penn State
5 Charlie Rogers Georgia Tech
6 Steve Johnson Tennessee

2000
Rnd Name College Note
1 Shaun Alexander Alabama
1 Chris McIntosh Wisconsin
2 Ike Charlton Virginia Tech
3 Darrell Jackson Florida
4 Marcus Bell Arizona
4 Isiah Kacyvenski Harvard
6 James Williams Marshall
6 Tim Watson Rowan
6 John Hilliard Mississippi State

2001
1 Koren Robinson North Carolina State
1 Steve Hutchinson Michigan
2 Ken Lucas Mississippi
3 Heath Evans Auburn
4 Orlando Huff Fresno State
4 Curtis Fuller Texas Christian
4 Floyd Womack Mississippi State
5 Alex Bannister Eastern Kentucky
6 Josh Booty Louisiana State
7 Harold Blackmon Northwestern
7 Dennis Norman Princeton
7 Kris Kocurek Texas Tech

2002
1 Jerramy Stevens Washington
2 Maurice Morris Oregon
2 Anton Palepoi UNLV
3 Kris Richard USC
4 Terreal Bierria Georgia
5 Rocky Bernard Texas A&M
5 Ryan Hannam Northern Iowa
5 Matt Hill Boise State
6 Craig Jarrett Michigan State
7 Jeff Kelly Southern Mississippi

JSWO - Josh Scobey World Order 4 Life!

by Christian on Oct 26, 2009 6:06 PM PDT up reply actions   1 recs

Now that's exciting football.

4 drafts, 10 first and second round picks, and only 3 difference makers. Jackson and Bernard are stretches in that designation, to say the least.

It's Great to be a Florida Gator!

Next year's notable Ex-Seahawks:
Walter Jones, Patrick Kerney, Seneca Wallace, Jordan Babineaux, Kelly Jennings

by Wayward Llama on Oct 26, 2009 6:23 PM PDT up reply actions  

Well, I don't find the Seahawks exciting right now

But then again, I cannot watch an entire Ravens game, so perhaps I like offense too much.

It is what it is...

by kidder95 on Oct 26, 2009 7:20 PM PDT up reply actions  

I don't mind losing so much is how we lose

We lose ugly these days. There is no growth to get excited about. Watching our defense grow reminds me of 90’s. Tez was great, but our offense was awful.

I would much rather watch a young offensive minded team lose than hope like hell to catch fire with Brad Johnson. But that is just me.

It is what it is...

by kidder95 on Oct 26, 2009 7:25 PM PDT up reply actions  

In 2007, we looked capable of standing toe to toe with any team,

and our losses were almost wholly due to miscues on our part (see: all 3 losses vs. the NFC South, AZ game where Shaun fumbled the handoff). The only loss we were actually dominated in was vs. Pittsburgh.

Now we get routinely raped and I’m not even surprised by it anymore.

"Mayhap a hidden door lurks nigh. Let us search the environs."

by Fearless Frog on Oct 26, 2009 9:19 PM PDT up reply actions  

Depends on what you consider a difference maker.

Mo Morris?
Jerramy Stevens?
KoRo?
Heath Evans or Orlando Huff?
Porkchop?
All solid players.

by LantermanC on Oct 26, 2009 7:24 PM PDT up reply actions  

as a trade

GM’s do more than draft. They also sign FA’s and trade for players.

"Its not that I can't read and write, its just that I don't like to read and write."
-Charlie

by ninjasocks on Oct 27, 2009 8:35 AM PDT up reply actions  

Robbie Tobeck!

"Mayhap a hidden door lurks nigh. Let us search the environs."

by Fearless Frog on Oct 27, 2009 9:39 AM PDT up reply actions  

Yeah, but we're just talking about drafting skills.

If you’re giving up two picks to get a player, it should count when all you’re doing is summing up the amount of ‘difference makers’ there are as a quantity instead of as a percentage.

by LantermanC on Oct 27, 2009 9:53 AM PDT up reply actions  

If we're only talking about drafting skills,

why would we include a trade in the discussion? And why this trade alone over all other trades? And why would we limit our discussion to the draft picks and one trade when a huge part of a GM’s job is signing FAs?

If we’re going to compare GM performance, we should compare GM performance, not just one arbitrary fraction of the job.

"Its not that I can't read and write, its just that I don't like to read and write."
-Charlie

by ninjasocks on Oct 27, 2009 4:10 PM PDT up reply actions  

Because he traded two picks away. If I traded all my picks away for Brady and Adrian Peterson,

you can’t go and say I’m a bad drafting GM because I have drafted zero impact players.

The whole argument is moot anyways since looking at just drafting skills in vacuum is impossible since salary cap, and trades as mentioned force different aspects of being a GM to be related.

by LantermanC on Oct 27, 2009 6:52 PM PDT up reply actions  

I think the difference is that a lot of Ruskell's picks will be playing in a few years.

Most of Holmy’s are out of the league.

It's Great to be a Florida Gator!

Next year's notable Ex-Seahawks:
Walter Jones, Patrick Kerney, Seneca Wallace, Jordan Babineaux, Kelly Jennings

by Wayward Llama on Oct 26, 2009 9:42 PM PDT up reply actions  

Ruskell hasn't been in office long enough to determine whether the same holds true for him.

His inaugural draft class just started hitting free agency.

"Mayhap a hidden door lurks nigh. Let us search the environs."

by Fearless Frog on Oct 26, 2009 10:21 PM PDT up reply actions  

Leroy and Lofa aren't

"Its not that I can't read and write, its just that I don't like to read and write."
-Charlie

by ninjasocks on Oct 27, 2009 8:36 AM PDT up reply actions  

Yes, I know that.

But we’ll have to wait a few more years to see whether the likes of Steve Vallos, Mansfield Wrotto, etc. ever do anything in the NFL.

"Mayhap a hidden door lurks nigh. Let us search the environs."

by Fearless Frog on Oct 27, 2009 9:40 AM PDT up reply actions  

Haha.

But the point is that if we’re drafting bad either way, why not get the guy who occasionally hits big?

"Mayhap a hidden door lurks nigh. Let us search the environs."

by Fearless Frog on Oct 27, 2009 9:41 AM PDT up reply actions  

Let me put it this way

Let’s say that Tim Ruskell is the worst drafting GM ever and it’s a foregone conclusion that he’s gone at the end of the season. Why replace him with someone that, at best, is only marginally better? If we’re looking for a GM, we can do better than Holmgren (who had his shot under Paul Allen but failed to impress)

by BrianL on Oct 27, 2009 11:06 AM PDT up reply actions  

Oh, I see what you're getting at.

You’re obviously right, if we were in fact searching for a GM, we shouldn’t be limited to just Mike Holmgren. And I suppose I’m not giving Ruskell enough credit for some decent drafts, but I don’t think they’ve been anywhere near as good as to not consider looking for someone else if the opportunity arises.

"Mayhap a hidden door lurks nigh. Let us search the environs."

by Fearless Frog on Oct 27, 2009 12:40 PM PDT up reply actions  

His first draft was bad.

After that, he basically added 2-3 players that were at least decent every year.

‘99: King was a bust but not completely terrible. Cochran was pretty good for a 4th rounder. This was easily his worst draft. I guess that’s to be expected as it was his first ever and with a new team.

‘00: Alexander, Djack, Kaz.
Alexander is obviously the most productive RB in franchise history, and the only MVP in team history.
Djack is currently Seattle’s #2 all-time WR behind Largent.
Kaz was an outstanding special teams player.
Drafts rarely get better than this.

‘01: K-Rob, Hutch, Hasselbeck (trade), Lucas, Evans, Huff, Bannister.
K-Rob had a special 2002 season that coincided with Hasselbeck’s rise. In the end he was a bust, but he did have his good moments.
Hutch, he’s probably the only Seahawk (besides maybe Curry) drafted this decade that has a good chance to make the HoF.
Hasselbeck- best Seahawk QB ever.
Lucas- very good safety with a nice career.
Huff- good player but left town as soon as deal ended.
Evans- solid FB who is still playing and has had a long, journeyman career. Bannister- remembered for the GB playoff game, but was a pro-bowl special teamer. This was the best draft of the decade for the Seahawks, in my opinion.

’02: Stevens, Mo-mo, Bernard

Stevens was hot and cold, but he did occasionally display the ability to be a game changer and someone that defenses had to account for. Even though its universally agreed that he’s a draft bust, he had a very nice 2005 season and had a few huge games other places too. He had a monster game against Dallas (the romo-fingers game) in the 2006 playoffs.
Mo-mo wasn’t a steal, but he had a very nice career in Seattle and was seemingly always over-valued when he didn’t deserve it and undervalued when he was actually playing his best.
Bernard was a very good value for a 5th round pick and has had a very nice career for a 5th round DT.

Overall, in 4 drafts, Holmgren had 1 very bad draft (1999), 1 very nice draft (2000), 1 outstanding draft (2001), and 1 bad but not horrible draft (2002). I think the misconception about Holmgren as a bad drafting GM is based on the magnitude of his misses. In 2002 alone, Palepoi, Richard, and Bierria were complete failures, back to back to back. The Stevens and K-Rob busts eventually became front page material, and not just in local papers. Things like that created a paradigm among many fans that Holmgren’s notable draft success were washed away and then some by his big mistakes.

The contrast with Holmgren v. Ruskell is that Ruskell excells at finding solid, longer term players whereas Holmgren finds a lower volume of good players but has a higher tendency to find superstars and pro-bowlers. If these men were baseball players, Ruskell would be someone who is consistent and safe, someone like Ichiro, Holmgren would be someone like Adam Dunn- a guy who doesn’t get a lot of hits and strikes out a lot, but makes up for it with the long ball.

I’m not advocating that Holmgren return to Seattle as GM. I think that all options need to be looked at, and its just too easy to throw Holmgren’s name in there. I’d be just fine with him not returning to Seattle, but I never liked the fairly recent trend of fans second guessing his drafts. They weren’t perfect, but they were not as bad as some have said, either.

by kearly on Oct 28, 2009 12:01 AM PDT up reply actions  

I thought a lot of the problems Holmgren had was reaching for a position of need

You saw that with the Lamar King and Chris McIntosh picks.

For that reason, I feel Ruskell is overall smarter at drafting. Ruskell picks don’t have the boom-bust potential of the Holmgren picks. That said, I’d rather have a players from the draft becoming starters, backups, or even in the practice squad rather than have half of them out of the league in a few years.

by aerozeppelin on Oct 28, 2009 12:24 PM PDT up reply actions  

Ruskell addresses need with cheap FAs before the draft

"Its not that I can't read and write, its just that I don't like to read and write."
-Charlie

by ninjasocks on Oct 31, 2009 7:42 PM PDT up reply actions  

He didn't trade Galloway, he just failed to sign him to a long term contract.

Dallas came in and signed him while he had the franchise tag on him, and as a rule had to give up 2 first round picks. It wasn’t Holmgren being smart (anyone would have franchised Galloway) but rather Jerry Jones being an idiot.

by Mind of no mind on Oct 27, 2009 2:10 AM PDT up reply actions  

what an amazing trade that was

I think Holmy and Ruskell as co GMs could make magic happen. Ruskell with the D, Holmy with the O.

by Hancock.Brett on Oct 26, 2009 5:52 PM PDT reply actions  

They would be arguing who is drafted in what round and such.

It would probably be a horrible partnership. It only worked out in Ruskell’s first year when the defense went from horrible to decent enough to not give up a score on every drive so the offense wouldn’t be in shoot-outs all the time.

"Mayhap a hidden door lurks nigh. Let us search the environs."

by Fearless Frog on Oct 26, 2009 9:23 PM PDT up reply actions  

That would be assuming a partnership would work

Their egos will eventually clash against each other. Also, I don’t see much evidence that suggests Holmgren is better than Ruskell at consistently drafting offensive prospects.

by aerozeppelin on Oct 27, 2009 2:56 PM PDT up reply actions  

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