Chansi Stuckey Traded to Cleveland Browns
by John Morgan on Oct 7, 2009 12:42 PM PDT
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PrintI had a few pressing responsibilities this morning (sleeping off my hangover, making coffee, figuring out where I was and the closest bus station, etc.) and didn't get a chance to report today's circus of league activity. I know my head is spinning. Chauncey Washington re-signs to the Cowboys practice squad, Zack Follett activated from the Lions practice squad, suspensions lifted on Saints kicker Garrett Hartley, and of course, the Browns trading for Chansi Stuckey -- that's huge. Still mad at Hartley for marring the game, this is the place to discuss it.
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Heh.
East West Coast bias. I love it.
Early prospect watch: RB C.J. Spiller, QB Jevan Snead, OT Ciron Black, DT Gerald McCoy, S Eric Berry, DT Ndamukong Suh, CB Ras-I Dowling 6'2, 200, RB Jonathan Dwyer
Hmmmmm, I wonder who the Jets got for Stuckey?
Probably not much…..certainly not a receiver who was ever drafted #3 overall in the past…..
What a couple of douchebags.
Next year's notable Ex-Seahawks:
Walter Jones, Patrick Kerney, Seneca Wallace
I am excited to see Crabtree play
and in celebration of this momentous day, maybe we should unban Frog.
by John Morgan on Oct 7, 2009 1:41 PM PDT reply actions 2 recs
Thanks.
I promise I’ll stop.
"I wish the Seahawks were back in the AFCW so we didn’t have to face Willis and Gore twice a year."
by Fearless Frog on Oct 7, 2009 1:51 PM PDT up reply actions
What you don't get is that I like you and think you are funny
but I also think you try to get banned. If someone tries to get banned, you kind of have to ban them.
Point taken.
"I wish the Seahawks were back in the AFCW so we didn’t have to face Willis and Gore twice a year."
by Fearless Frog on Oct 7, 2009 2:17 PM PDT up reply actions
Point taken.
"I wish the Seahawks were back in the AFCW so we didn’t have to face Willis and Gore twice a year."
by Fearless Frog on Oct 7, 2009 2:20 PM PDT up reply actions
Now you're just being greedy.
I will smash your face into a jelly.
by Phil Hatzenbuehler on Oct 7, 2009 2:22 PM PDT up reply actions
Glad to see Lanterman is joining me in my accidental double-posting exploits.
"I wish the Seahawks were back in the AFCW so we didn’t have to face Willis and Gore twice a year."
by Fearless Frog on Oct 7, 2009 6:26 PM PDT up reply actions
There were SBN issues after the update that went up last night.
Bugs all over the place.
What sort of update?
Any new posting features or was it fixing code or something like that?
"I wish the Seahawks were back in the AFCW so we didn’t have to face Willis and Gore twice a year."
by Fearless Frog on Oct 7, 2009 8:10 PM PDT up reply actions
I'm not sure if it was an update or maintenance
but all of SBN was offline last night for some kind of work. Problems seem to have stemmed from there.
I hate seeing a division rival get better,
but I’m interested in seeing how good Crabtree can be. Sort of like the Neftali Feliz guy on the Rangers.
I hate seeing a division rival get better,
but I’m interested in seeing how good Crabtree can be. Sort of like the Neftali Feliz guy on the Rangers.
plee
"I wish the Seahawks were back in the AFCW so we didn’t have to face Willis and Gore twice a year."
Apart from my ringing headache making me nice
Who wins the Jets trade, because I am thinking this could be lose-lose.
It's gotta be the Browns, right?
They get a serviceable replacement of Edwards in Stuckey, a linebacker, and two draft picks. What’s not to like?
I will smash your face into a jelly.
by Phil Hatzenbuehler on Oct 7, 2009 2:01 PM PDT up reply actions
Everyone hates on Edwards
but I think he could still be a special receiver if he plays with a quarterback that can pass.
Is that going to stop him from dropping balls?
""I wanted to be a quarterback, but I got hungry."
-LG Rob Sims
Dropped passes are a function of the quarterback and receiver
Everyone was sure Roddy White and Michael Jenkins couldn’t catch before Ryan, too.
Sure
a QB who puts the ball in an awkward place is going to have WRs that drop a lot. I thought, though, that Edwards had issues dropping beyond what the QB was doing.
Here’s an article that seems to support my suspicion:
http://www.cleveland.com/pluto/blog/index.ssf/2008/10/cleveland_browns_biggest_letdo.html
Anderson has thrown the ball to Edwards 49 times, more than anyone else on the team. The result is a mere 20 receptions.
Over and over, Anderson and offensive coordinator Rob Chudzinski have been giving Edwards chances to catch the ball, to make an impact. That’s why it was so annoying to hear Edwards say he was frustrated in the Washington game because he was open a few times early in the game, and Anderson didn’t pass to him.
He is on a team where no one else has more than one dropped pass, and he’s missed 10. He’s on a team with a quarterback who loves to throw in his direction, with a coaching staff that believes in him and has protected him from criticism. He’s on a team where he is the main guy, a role that Edwards has always said he wanted and deserved.
""I wanted to be a quarterback, but I got hungry."
-LG Rob Sims
The last two paragraphs are from the blockquote
but weren’t highlighted for some reason.
""I wanted to be a quarterback, but I got hungry."
-LG Rob Sims
Articles like that will always support the team and target the player
The fact is, “drop” is a subjectively defined stat—like an error. Let us see if Edwards is still a problem with a much more accurate passer throwing him the ball. I do not know another more effective way to find out.
There's lot of other articles that say something similar
but it is possible that he may get his act together with a new QB. A new, new coach and different environment can’t hurt either.
But I don’t expect him to have much of an impact with the Jets offense for a while. He’s going to need time to learn the offense and get cozy with Sanchez before he has success in the new system. I think there’s a good chance that we won’t find out until next year whether he can shake off his bad reputation.
""I wanted to be a quarterback, but I got hungry."
-LG Rob Sims
Philosophical conundrum -
Does the receiver drop the ball because his quarterback is inaccurate? Or is the quarterback inaccurate because his receiver drops the ball?
Unnecessary.
It's Great to be a Florida Gator!
Next year's notable Ex-Seahawks:
Walter Jones, Patrick Kerney, Seneca Wallace
by Wayward Llama on Oct 7, 2009 6:36 PM PDT up reply actions
You could have at least significantly resized it.
"I wish the Seahawks were back in the AFCW so we didn’t have to face Willis and Gore twice a year."
by Fearless Frog on Oct 7, 2009 8:10 PM PDT up reply actions
*shrug*
I liked the overblown size and lighting of the picture. In my mind it matches the overblown man-love heaped on Willis by a certain fan base; a fan base that would put faith in their linebacker’s ability to dance on a pin head. I kinda dig that mentality, and enjoy our adopted ‘49ers fan, Brendan, because he seems to share it. I’d be proud to see a picture like this, but starring Tatupu for similar reasons, over on niners nation.
Or maybe, when looking for a picture to include, I saw a snapshot of Willis trying to knock the third nipple off of Hasselbeck and posted this picture while in the resultant zombie-like stupor.
Did other WRs on the Browns drop balls at a similar rate?
If not, where there any extenuating circumstances (did the QB give the butter-fingered WR the ball in especially difficult situations)?
""I wanted to be a quarterback, but I got hungry."
-LG Rob Sims
In 08 none of the Browns caught the ball well, although none of them were known for their hands
Edwards – 40% catch rate
Steptoe – 46% catch rate
Stallworth – 38% catch rate
Jurevicius put up catch rates of 62% in both 06 and 07 which is ~average.
"Catch rate" is very different from "drop rate"
No receiver is dropping 60% of the balls thrown to him (even Pollard/Stevenson/Alexander).
""I wanted to be a quarterback, but I got hungry."
-LG Rob Sims
Catch rate is what actually matters
And for receivers on the same team there shouldn’t be any difference. Unless you think a quarterback is less accurate when throwing to receivers not named Braylon.
Catch rate
doesn’t answer the question of whether a given player has a problem dropping balls.
""I wanted to be a quarterback, but I got hungry."
-LG Rob Sims
I compared players on the same team
You would expect the quarterback to throw the same ball to all of those receivers so the biggest variable is balls the receivers flat out drop. Edwards catch rate being roughly equal to his team mates means he dropped balls at a roughly equal pace as his team mates.
Not that drops matter that much, they’re just a subset of not caught balls.
But catch rate doesn't necessarily have anything to do with drop rate
You could have a 60% catch rate and drop 30% of your targets. You could have decent hands but the worst case of the dropsies in the league.
""I wanted to be a quarterback, but I got hungry."
-LG Rob Sims
And the worst case of dropsies wouldn't mean anything
Theres no point in taking about drop rate, catch rate is what matters.
Roddy White went on record to say he had no work ethic and was a lazy ass when Vick was the QB.
"I wish the Seahawks were back in the AFCW so we didn’t have to face Willis and Gore twice a year."
by Fearless Frog on Oct 7, 2009 3:45 PM PDT up reply actions
Maybe the contact high was destroying his work ethic
""I wanted to be a quarterback, but I got hungry."
-LG Rob Sims
Heh.
"I wish the Seahawks were back in the AFCW so we didn’t have to face Willis and Gore twice a year."
by Fearless Frog on Oct 7, 2009 8:11 PM PDT up reply actions
Edwards
Has the most potential of any receiver 26 or under in the league other than Megatron. The one year CLE had a legit offense he was on a tear…
I am not sure how high the two draft picks were but Edwards is a star, although a bit of a volatile one. I know Edwards has his flaws and there are arguments against his worth but turning spare parts into a star player is a win.
I like Stuckey but he is a late round talent.
* just playing devil's advocate
I like this trade for both sides because Edwards was not working out for them and the Jets are contending and need a plug and play weapon on offense.
I don't think Edwards is plug and play, though
In fact, this could set New York back short term like Williams did in Dallas.
My lose-lose feeling is that
Stuckey is a good receiver that doesn’t cost New York a thing and is with the team for few more years. Edwards is at the end of his contract. If he doesn’t produce right away, and I don’t think he will, then the Jets are in a bind. They give a ton and maybe get nothing. Meanwhile, the Browns need talent, bad. That is a losing franchise right now. It should be looking at a quarterback in next year’s draft. It could have franchised Edwards, without much to lose, because the team is clearly rebuilding and might as well see if Edwards clicks with another signal caller. It would also give that quarterback a soft landing. Stuckey doesn’t do anything like that.
Also, Edwards becomes a RFA if next season is uncapped.
Early prospect watch: RB C.J. Spiller, QB Jevan Snead, OT Ciron Black, DT Gerald McCoy, S Eric Berry, DT Ndamukong Suh, CB Ras-I Dowling 6'2, 200, RB Jonathan Dwyer
I think history has shown us
that WRs traded during a season don’t tend to do well that season
Y’know, chemistry, playbook and all that. Plus it’s Braylon Edwards – he has to learn how to catch again every week
Then again, he apparently wanted big money in a possible trade druing the offseason, so I wonder if they can afford to keep him around
Huh, look at that.
I didn’t realize that Stuckey and Edwards are more-or-less the same age. I was thinking Stuckey was two years younger (I thought Edwards was drafted in ‘06, and Stuckey in ’08). Now knowing that, I can’t see a clear winner in this deal.
I will smash your face into a jelly.
by Phil Hatzenbuehler on Oct 7, 2009 2:10 PM PDT up reply actions
It's the brick layers, gladiators argument Brian Burke made
theoretically, Edwards is the kind of talent that is rare enough that a team can give up a lot to acquire him. I made a mistake when the Vikings traded for Jared Allen. Minnesota gave an absolute ton, but Allen has proven to be the kind of player that is rare enough to merit it. I don’t know if that’s Edwards, but that is what the Jets are counting on.
I also wonder if Derek Anderson is available
I’ve never, ever been a fan, but he certainly matches Knapp’s offense. Seattle could direct swap with Branch, possibly.
I'd be okay with trading for Derek Anderson.
Plus, Dave Sims could reappropriate his, “Tell it to the DA!” David Aardsma call for football.
I will smash your face into a jelly.
by Phil Hatzenbuehler on Oct 7, 2009 2:16 PM PDT up reply actions
We tried to get Anderson but the Browns would only part w/ Frye at the time.
Maybe that’s changed, but I doubt it seeing how Anderson is now the starter…
Early prospect watch: RB C.J. Spiller, QB Jevan Snead, OT Ciron Black, DT Gerald McCoy, S Eric Berry, DT Ndamukong Suh, CB Ras-I Dowling 6'2, 200, RB Jonathan Dwyer
Anderson can't be any worse than Seneca at moving the ball up the field.
But even though I don’t think Branch is ever going to be that great for us, I’m still reluctant to part ways with him, especially since he’s probably going to net a really low return. Looking at our WR corps and that old adage about being one injury away and all that.
I’m still a hopeless Brady Quinn fan though, I wonder if Mangini would look into trading him. Though I haven’t seen Quinn play this season, and hear it hasn’t been the hometown hero thing it was supposed to be.
"I wish the Seahawks were back in the AFCW so we didn’t have to face Willis and Gore twice a year."
by Fearless Frog on Oct 7, 2009 2:26 PM PDT up reply actions
It wouldn’t be the first time we’ve take a Browns cast-off QB!
by Kevin M Smith on Oct 7, 2009 2:33 PM PDT up reply actions
I like this idea.
I’m not a huge fan of his, but “Dawgs by Nature” is like Lord of the Flies over today’s trade. We could probably just sneak Anderson out and no one would notice.
Charlie Frye makes me fear Anderson
I know that’s not rational, but just the way it is. They both strike me as the same QB – with Cleveland able to squeeze a season of ’success" out of each of them by running a simplified offense, and not much game film for opponents on either.
"I'm tired of chasing after my dreams. I'll just find out where they're going, and catch up later." - Hedberg
If you're talking about the Jet's GM, I think he's just trying to justify the trade to his fans.
And make it sound like, ‘who cares what his numbers are now, we’re building a winner’.
If you're talking about the trade, I think he's just trying to justify the trade to his fans.
And make it sound like, ‘who cares what his numbers are now, we’re building a winner’.
Ha, SBN is acting so weird lately, this took so long to post, I changed it and clicked post
and I guess it double posted.
Also, the new comments and unread comments functions aren't working for me.
Anyone having this problem?
It was happening on Lookout Landing earlier.
SBN finally got it fixed, and it’s working for me fine on Field Gulls now.
I will smash your face into a jelly.
by Phil Hatzenbuehler on Oct 7, 2009 2:27 PM PDT up reply actions
There was a site upgrade last night
This is an inordinate amount of bugs, but at least the robots aren’t going crazy and trying to kill the patrons.
Here is an article I found interesting regarding the CLE-NYJ trade.
http://www.cleveland.com/pluto/blog/index.ssf/2009/10/if_im_cleveland_browns_coach_e.html
Early prospect watch: RB C.J. Spiller, QB Jevan Snead, OT Ciron Black, DT Gerald McCoy, S Eric Berry, DT Ndamukong Suh, CB Ras-I Dowling 6'2, 200, RB Jonathan Dwyer
The Fresh Prince on New York.
"I wish the Seahawks were back in the AFCW so we didn’t have to face Willis and Gore twice a year."
by Fearless Frog on Oct 7, 2009 3:44 PM PDT up reply actions
of
"I wish the Seahawks were back in the AFCW so we didn’t have to face Willis and Gore twice a year."
by Fearless Frog on Oct 7, 2009 3:44 PM PDT up reply actions
So question for you guys
Do you think the fact that Crabtree signed had anything to do with the Jets trading for Edwards or was it just a coincidence?
Good question.
Maybe the Jets pulled the trigger on Edwards once it looked likely that MC Hammer & co. were going to crank out a deal with SF.
"I wish the Seahawks were back in the AFCW so we didn’t have to face Willis and Gore twice a year."
by Fearless Frog on Oct 7, 2009 6:25 PM PDT up reply actions
That would seem to indicate
That there was at least some form of tampering going on then, if they were thinking they were going to get Crabtree.
by Brendan Scolari on Oct 7, 2009 11:57 PM PDT up reply actions
Not necessarily.
Maybe they were just anticipating trading for him after the season ended or drafting him if he re-entered the draft. It wouldn’t be tampering if they didn’t express these views to Crabtree and his agent.
"I wish the Seahawks were back in the AFCW so we didn’t have to face Willis and Gore twice a year."
by Fearless Frog on Oct 8, 2009 9:54 AM PDT up reply actions
Right
But then why would Crabtree signing have had any influence on the deals?
by Brendan Scolari on Oct 8, 2009 8:12 PM PDT up reply actions
Can I make a request?
If Crabtree catches a pass against us and then makes Curry look silly, Fearless can harp about it for at least a day?
I would probably lose the will to after leaving the game thread.
At this point, I’d probably be more disappointed if Eugene Monroe stonewalls Curry off an edge-blitz considering the state of our tackles right now.
"I wish the Seahawks were back in the AFCW so we didn’t have to face Willis and Gore twice a year."
by Fearless Frog on Oct 7, 2009 8:13 PM PDT up reply actions
Really
Seattle’s tackles are not playing that bad. Seneca Wallace. I can not stress this enough: Seneca Wallace.
I am not underestimating how bad Seneca Wallace's pocket-presence is.
But there’s no getting around that we’re starting Brandon Frye at left tackle, regardless of his performance.
Also, maybe it’s just Julius, but I don’t think our interior line is doing very well open up holes in the running game.
"I wish the Seahawks were back in the AFCW so we didn’t have to face Willis and Gore twice a year."
by Fearless Frog on Oct 7, 2009 9:42 PM PDT up reply actions
Has Brandon Frye been any worse than Lock?
He had a bad day against Freeney, but he seemed to hold up pretty well against SF and CHI.
""I wanted to be a quarterback, but I got hungry."
-LG Rob Sims
Eh, I suppose you're right.
"I wish the Seahawks were back in the AFCW so we didn’t have to face Willis and Gore twice a year."
by Fearless Frog on Oct 8, 2009 1:06 PM PDT up reply actions
Read that one wrong.
At first glance I thought that said “Monroe swallows Curry” and I chuckled. Monroe’s big, but Curry is at least two or three meals.
I see it being lose-lose if Edwards leaves the Jets in the off-season.
As the Jets would have given up entirely too much for nothing. One of the draft picks cleveland acquires might be as high as a 2nd, but it’s more like middle to late round picks. But this does open up possibilities for the rest of the Jets’ offense, in paticular, the running game and their TE’s.
Stuckey, as much as I love his name, won’t be able to do a whole lot for cleveland as the most he has going for him is that he is somewhat familiar with the Browns’ offense. He’s very quick and can get seperation. I wonder if he will be starting right away or if they will give Robiskie a shot.
I do not get Mangini’s model for building a team. But than again, isn’t everything Browns a secret? You hit it on the head John! Man-Genius has scooped up so many god damn players from NYJ who have played for him but what good is it to have players who are familiar with your style of coaching if there is a complete lack of talent. Must suck to be a Browns fan right now.
If uncapped year, Edwards is a RFA, not UFA.
And then there’s always the Franchise Tag, but I’m not sure how the uncapped year affects that.
Early prospect watch: RB C.J. Spiller, QB Jevan Snead, OT Ciron Black, DT Gerald McCoy, S Eric Berry, DT Ndamukong Suh, CB Ras-I Dowling 6'2, 200, RB Jonathan Dwyer
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