Michael Crabtree at Four
by John Morgan on Apr 7, 2009 4:24 PM PDT
72 comments
Michael Crabtree
Birthdate: September 14, 1987
Height/Weight: 6'1 3/8"/215
Position: Wide Receiver
College: Texas Tech, 26 games played
Notable Stats: 231 receptions, 3,127 yards, 41 TDs
My Take: A couple months ago it was heresy to argue Seattle should select anyone at four but Michael Crabtree. That is, if he was even available. Now his availability is in little doubt and few are talking about Seattle selecting him. That has a little do with Seattle signing TJ Houshmandzadeh, and lot more to do with a blunderous couple of months that saw Crabtree participating in the combine only enough to be discovered two inches shorter, before discovering a stress fracture in his foot. He elected to have surgery. That surgery means Crabtree will not perform any pre-draft agility drills. It would be nice to know if Crabtree can run at a respectable rate, but it's not reason in itself to knock him down draft boards. Nevertheless, the next Larry Fitzgerald is now the next Anquan Boldin, and that's a sizable drop.
Let's give scouts and GMs credit. The concern isn't so much can Crabtree run really fast in a straight line on a track in street clothes, it's can Crabtree separate from NFL caliber cornerbacks? Combine numbers function as a surrogate for strength of competition. Crabtree did most of his damage against especially bush league competition. Of his 26 opponents, ten were non-BCS, or BCS schools with defenses that ranked 100th or worse in FEI. Another four ranked 70th or worse in FEI. In his two years, Crabtree faced seven opponents with a top 30 defensive FEI. Since we don't have combine number, let's instead look at some adjusted performance numbers. The backbone of these will be yards per target. It's a stat I debuted last year in this post. The only bad news is the official scorer of the Cotton Bowl did not record who was targeted on incomplete passes. The good news is that the six other games included that data, and the sample is relatively robust: 88 targets.
Here's how Crabtree looks:
Yards per target: 9.67 (DeSean Jackson: 9.5, Eddie Royal 8.88, Devin Thomas 8.08, Jordy Nelson 7.57, Limas Sweed 6.3)
Completion Percentage: 69% (Desean Jackson 63%, Eddie Royal 52.9%, Devin Thomas 56%, Jordy Nelson 63.3%, Limas Sweed 55%)
First Downs: 27 (1 per 3 attempts not resulting in a touchdown)
Touchdowns: 7 (1 per 12.57 attempts)
First Down or Touchdown: 34 (1 per 2.59 attempts)
Fumbles: 3
Pass Interference Against: 1
That's very, very good. As I've stated before, I don't have enough data to see if this is truly predicative, but I think it has merit, more merit than simple yards. The completion percentage is especially interesting, because the biggest concern about Crabtree is his ability to get open. The offense he played in boosts that number, but, I guess you could say, that Crabtree was so often double-teamed probably cancels that out a bit.
Combine numbers be damned, I think Crabtree is special, and, not considering position, the best player in this draft. He's going to make some team's fans very happy, even if they'll have to resign themselves to the fact that Crabtree will never best Ashley Lelie in a footrace.
*Which isn't to say I prefer Seattle drafting Crabtree to Matthew Stafford, only that if Seattle drafted Crabtree, I'd still be pretty amped.
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Has Seattle met with Crabtree at all?
They’ve been suspiciously quiet about him.
by Nate Dogg on Apr 7, 2009 4:36 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
I'm 95% positive they interviewed him at the combine.
Of course it was a while ago, so my memory may be a little sketchy.
by Trepidation on Apr 7, 2009 4:49 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
So much subterfuge this time of year
Seattle hasn’t shown much visible interest – but is it because they’re truly not interested, or because they don’t want to tip their hand.
by jteckmann on Apr 7, 2009 4:58 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
They met with him at least twice at the combine
Haven’t heard anything since. Them and every other top 15 pick team will probably talk to his doctors before the draft to see how things went.
by B.B.Finnegan on Apr 7, 2009 5:16 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Can you clarify something?
Touchdowns: 7 (1 per 12,57 attempts)
I feel the same way about Crabtree and Stafford, though I would be less disappointed if we miss on Crabtree with everything that’s happened regarding him. Maybe that the hype has cooled, it’s a good sign towards Crabtree, knowing the misdirecting, somewhat unpredictable TR.
by Misfit74 on Apr 7, 2009 4:59 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
The comma is a typo, now corrected.
It means he had a touchdown reception every 12.57 receptions. Completion percentage is the same as what Football Outsiders calls “catch rate”.
by John Morgan on Apr 7, 2009 6:26 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Good write-up
I especially agree with the conclusion.
Stafford or Crabtree are the only possible choices I can get “excited” for – and for Stafford it’s mainly because he addresses the all important but hard to fill need, not because I’m particularly sold on him as a prospect. I’m not feeling the love for any of the OT’s, and we’ve been down the road of how drafting Curry is hampered by diminishing returns.
Crabtree strikes me as the Adrian Peterson of this draft – yeah, other positions may be more important and harder to adequately fill, and you run the risk of his career going to waste because of those unaddressed weaknesses … but dang, he sure is going to be exciting to watch and worth every cent you’re paying him.
by jteckmann on Apr 7, 2009 5:17 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Stafford still scares me a little
Crabtree I really think is going to be the stud of the draft. And probably at least one of the top O-lineman. These stats really help though.
I wonder JM, would it be best to compare his stats to other receivers on the same team? Eric Morris and Detron Lewis caught over 70 a piece and Danny Amendola caught over 100 the year before, so there’s a pretty good sample size. This might be a way of seeing if his stats have more to do with the system. Different caliber of players, I know, but I don’t know how else you could proof check the system. Just an idea.
by B.B.Finnegan on Apr 7, 2009 5:28 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Red flags?
Does anyone have any information why so many analysts and scouts are concerned about Crabtree’s character?
It is what it is...
by kidder95 on Apr 7, 2009 5:57 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
nothing concrete, AFAIK
There’s the story of his roommate getting busted by the DEA, so people are making the “guilty by association” whispers. That doesn’t bother me much. IMO, anyone who ever had to live in shared housing should be understanding of the fact that your roommates can get by with a ton of stuff you don’t know about, or even if you do know about it, you decide it’s better to keep your mouth shut and nose out of it and just cash the rent checks.
Mainly, I think it’s because he took a PR hit at the combine and wasn’t the most polished public speaker. He’s a 20yr old kid getting pulled in 20 different directions and with 20 different people talking his his ear, and he’s getting grief for it.
Just like every year there’s the “workout warrior” who shoots up the boards, it seems like every year there’s the exact opposite: the solid prospect who gets nitpicked and slides for a variety of minor reasons.
by jteckmann on Apr 7, 2009 6:36 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Not about Guilt or Innocence.
Many try to turn this into a legal issue. It’s not! This has absolutely nothing to do with whether or not he was involved.
In an NFL where:
-guys shoot themselves in the leg
-smash the faces of strippers into stages in Vegas, and…
-are getting tasered by police after finding “cocaine baggies” in their pants trying to enter a club…
it is very well within the scope of due diligence to investigate exactly what did Crabtree know about the roommates cocaine dealing.
Why?
even if you do know about it, you decide it’s better to keep your mouth shut and nose out of it and just cash the rent checks.
…because one day, keeping your mouth shut puts you in the car with a guy running 50 pounds of weed to Galveston.
Bring Your Game, Leave Your Name.
by iverson2169 on Apr 7, 2009 6:54 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
that's the type of conclusion jumping I'm talking about
Quick story – during college I shared an apartment with a good high school friend who started getting into bad stuff. I wanted nothing to do with it and stayed as far away as possible. On the other hand, I tried to help the guy out and keep him from going off the deep end, since he was my friend. My name was on the lease of the apartment, but I didn’t stay there much. And there’s no way I was stupid enough to put my foot down or give any of the guys he was involved with any reason to think I was a “narc” or going to run my mouth. As soon as the lease was up, I found a new place to live, and my friend and I drifted apart. I wound up in grad school, he wound up in jail. It happens.
I’m more than familiar with the nuances of the situation.
I’m not blind to the nuances of the situation.
by jteckmann on Apr 7, 2009 7:21 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
d'oh ... forgot to proofread
echo … echo
by jteckmann on Apr 7, 2009 7:23 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
... and this story is exactly the opposite of what I am talking about.
For every “one” of you, there is “one” of the guys who turns out to be a Plax, Reggie Williams, or Byron Bam Morris. Nobody is suggesting Crabtree is undraftable, or that he is guilty. Your not reading the content of the post.
If you perform your due diligence and his character is clear in your mind…. fine…. great… you sleep better at night knowing that your 50 million over 5 years is safe.
But you don’t IGNORE what happened. You don’t draft a guy and guarantee him MILLIONS of Seahawk dollars without at least asking the questions. Period.
And there’s no way I was stupid enough to put my foot down or give any of the guys he was involved with any reason to think I was a "narc" or going to run my mouth.
If you were staring a #4 overall pick in the draft in the face, it might change your mind what you “allow” to go on under your nose.
Bring Your Game, Leave Your Name.
by iverson2169 on Apr 7, 2009 7:38 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Barring an incredibly stupid answer to that question
it’s a non issue.
by Nate Dogg on Apr 7, 2009 7:45 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I've never said you don't investigate Crabtree's character
You’re not reading the content of my posts. Obviously you check him out.
All I’ve said is that you keep the incident in the proper perspective, and that I think most people are making too much of it.
As for what Crabtree can and cannot “allow”, you don’t know if you’re not in his situation. For example, a pissed off dealer that might decide to take his frustrations out on your kneecaps can be even more incentive to stay quiet if you’re looking at a future NFL contract.
But by all means, continue to speculate away about what he should/should not have done.
by jteckmann on Apr 7, 2009 7:53 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Im not at all speculating about what he should have done...
my point the entire time is that you check it out. Never once said he was involved, and never once prescribed a course of action for him.
You then responded that my post was jumping to conclusions? There were no conclusions at all, except that you do your due diligence on the matter.
Bring Your Game, Leave Your Name.
by iverson2169 on Apr 7, 2009 7:58 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
then we're needlessly arguing about nothing
because that’s all I’ve ever said about the subject as well (not just this thread, but others)
But in my defense, this was the “conclusion” I was reacting to:
because one day, keeping your mouth shut puts you in the car with a guy running 50 pounds of weed to Galveston.
It’s all good, though. We’re on the same page.
by jteckmann on Apr 7, 2009 8:09 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
ah... no no.
I was saying that good guys sometimes keep bad company (which can affect the security of your draft dollars)
By the way…. we were debating…. not arguing. I have read many of your posts since joining here and respect your opinion greatly.
Bring Your Game, Leave Your Name.
by iverson2169 on Apr 7, 2009 8:17 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
PS... back to the actual point.
The problem with just keeping your mouth shut is that people take advantage of you. If I am an NFL GM, I want to know….
Is this player (a good guy) going to keep his mouth shut while his family is busy summarily executing people in his manhattan condo (J Vilma). Ray Lewis darn near lost his freedom associating with thugs, and he’s one of the all-time greats.
Whether he knew or not about the actual activities, you HAVE TO KNOW what kind of people your associating with.
This is about investment security and not about the fact MC is innocent here. Sometimes good guys keep bad company. It would be my job as an NFL GM to find out what company MC keeps.
Bring Your Game, Leave Your Name.
by iverson2169 on Apr 7, 2009 8:16 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
From what I heard, Crabtree is a very hard-working guy with no character concerns.
Aside from that thing about his roommate slangin’ rock or something.
"Part, fools!
Put up your swords. You know not what you do."
by Fearless Frog on Apr 7, 2009 8:30 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
The really scary thing about this article
is the reference in the photo caption to Hasselbeck as an Objectivist. Is this really true? If so, should we expect the creation of a special endzone section for overprivileged children called Gulls’ Gulch? (Perhaps off-topic, but it’s in the write-up, so I take it it’s fair game.)
by dagraham on Apr 7, 2009 6:30 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Holmgren didn't "retire"
He’s in the deserts of Arizona forming his secret enclave of precision passing purists as we speak. He’ll be waiting for Matt to come find him once he’s pushed out the door.
by jteckmann on Apr 7, 2009 6:56 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Old Field Gulls joke reference
"Hey, guess what? Nobody cares who would win in a crazy fantasy fist-fight between Anne Frank and Lizzie Borden." The Monarch
by crushedoptimist on Apr 7, 2009 11:52 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Deon
may make your dreams come true
As reported by Danny O’Neil:
There were 11 other players who were held out of Tuesday’s practice because of health issues. Wide receiver Deion Branch was among those. He had an arthroscopic procedure to clean up the knee he had operated on after the 2007 season.
“Nothing serious,” Mora said
Not sure what it all means, but sure doesn’t feel good.
It is what it is...
by kidder95 on Apr 7, 2009 6:34 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
My bad, I cannot spell
It is what it is...
by kidder95 on Apr 7, 2009 6:34 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Great, Great write-up!
I have been looking for this type of stats analysis that rate his performances against level of competition. Question if I may:
I didn’t see anything in your write up about the Spread that Tech was running. How do you (does one) account for the gaudy numbers put up in spread offenses? and how should that play into a teams decision?
I look at Crabtree and it’s an enigma of sorts.
I see, bad ankle, gaudy spread offense numbers, lousy competition, loose associations with a cocaine dealer…. and yet there is just something so compelling about a 215 pound WR that puts 40 TD’s on the board in 2 years.
Bring Your Game, Leave Your Name.
by iverson2169 on Apr 7, 2009 6:44 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
I believe the spread offense they ran down at Texas Tech
was basically designed around getting the receivers the ball with some room to run, and letting their athleticism take over from there. The receiver still has to make the catch, and still has to run the routes right, as well as run after the ball to build up those ridiculous reception yard numbers.
by Fear on Apr 7, 2009 6:55 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think my biggest objection... strike that... fear... is
that Harrell launched nearly 1000 passes in 2 years. Kinda hard not to have big numbers if your talented and playing against inferior competition with THAT MANY passes being thrown.
Bring Your Game, Leave Your Name.
by iverson2169 on Apr 7, 2009 6:57 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
while I see your point
how many receivers in any offense have caught 134 passes and 22 tds as a freshmen? At any year? Yes, the system makes a difference, and we should not judge on total numbers alone, but with that many reps what it really does is allow a 2 year player to be evaluated like a 4 year one. Unlike QB’s, receiver evaluation isn’t handicapped by the spread offense.
by B.B.Finnegan on Apr 8, 2009 8:10 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
granted.
I still think he’s an amazing WR prospect. My enthusiasm is just tempered a bit by some of the circumstances surrounding his resume’.
Bring Your Game, Leave Your Name.
by iverson2169 on Apr 8, 2009 11:32 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I always had a question about that.
In a spread offense, wouldn’t it be the QB’s numbers that are inflated? Or the secondary receivers?
"Part, fools!
Put up your swords. You know not what you do."
by Fearless Frog on Apr 9, 2009 12:16 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Sure of course...
…but I also think Harrell throwing nearly 1000 passes (1000 PASSES!!!) in two years most certainly gives a WR (even a primary WR) far more targets than just about any pro-style offense in the NCAA’s.
Bring Your Game, Leave Your Name.
by iverson2169 on Apr 9, 2009 11:32 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
dangit i wasn't finished but hit the post button...
That being said, I still believe it takes an amazing athlete to turn those targets into the kind of production that Crabtree had. I just think that the stats are inflated due to the very unusually high number of passes thrown an relatively weak competition.
Bring Your Game, Leave Your Name.
by iverson2169 on Apr 9, 2009 11:38 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
That's where competion % and yards per target come in.
They both are unaffected by huge passing numbers. And both of these numbers are still outstanding, as you can tell by the people JM compares them to.
by Fear on Apr 7, 2009 7:15 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
I was just typing the same thing.
(also in reply to iverson). There are plenty of examples to compare WRs. A quick way is to look at this or if you like FFB, this which is sortable – a nice feature to use.
by Misfit74 on Apr 7, 2009 7:33 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
thanks for the resource links
How does this translate to NCAA though? If I may play devils advocate for a minute…
completion % and yards per target may not be affected by volume of throws, but most certainly CAN be affected by running a spread offense.
The spread makes it very difficult to double a SE, and theoretically provides larger seams in the defense. Factor 1000 throws in to the equation, and it seems probable that any of this years top WR prospects would have put up major numbers in that offense.
yes? no?
Bring Your Game, Leave Your Name.
by iverson2169 on Apr 7, 2009 7:53 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I would have to know more about John's assertion
that Crabtree was doubled and that it was done frequently enough to offset some of the spread offense factor.
The offense he played in boosts that number, but, I guess you could say, that Crabtree was so often double-teamed probably cancels that out a bit.
That would be very tough for me to verify, not having seen entire T.Tech’s games and just clips. Certainly a debatable issue, though. We definitely have and idea that Harrel’s numbers were inflated. Is that enough to suggest Crabtree’s weren’t? Good question.
Even so, I have seen some of the plays Crabtree has made. He’s they type of guy you can just see that he’s a football player. Special. I would venture to suggest that the numbers may not be as important with a player of his style.
by Misfit74 on Apr 7, 2009 9:38 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I hear you...
It’s one of those things where the signs…
-shorter than thought
-slow 40 (admittedly not important)
-spread offense
-foot problems
-association with the roommate
….don’t match our gut instincts about the guy. He passes the eye filter. He appears to be the real deal.
Bring Your Game, Leave Your Name.
by iverson2169 on Apr 7, 2009 9:42 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Agreed.
But, for perspective, Crabtree’s list is pretty clean and it doesn’t look like this:
-been arrested
-known to have used marijuana/drugs
-reputation as a partier in school, heavy user of alcohol
-academic issues
-gang affiliations
-small school player
-1 year wonder
by Misfit74 on Apr 8, 2009 8:41 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
without question.
I’m more just commenting on the fact that he is a draft “faller”, as opposed to a draft “riser” (which by the way, I have never paid any attention to anyway).
Bring Your Game, Leave Your Name.
by iverson2169 on Apr 8, 2009 11:34 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I like Crabtree. A lot. But...
Signing Houshmandzadeh changed everything in regards to our WR situation. Drafting Crabtree might make it a bit overkill. Deion Branch, a #3 receiver? Certainly not paid like one. Especially if we resign K-Rob and one of the project WRs like Hass pans out as a decent 5th option we could have a WR group of Housh, Branch, Burleson, Robinson, Hass, and Kent/Taylor/(McMullen?). That’s not ridiculously epic but it’s still pretty good.
Add to the fact that someone like Brian Robiskie or Brandon Gibson could be drafted and add even more depth and youth, and Crabtree seems more and more like a luxury pick we really don’t need.
"Part, fools!
Put up your swords. You know not what you do."
by Fearless Frog on Apr 7, 2009 8:34 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Agreed
I think Housh killed the chances of us drafting Crabtree. Crabtree is my favorite player in this draft, but I don’t see us taking him at 4. You don’t need a 40 time to see that he can just flat out play. It feels like we will pick Stafford.
by KitIsh on Apr 7, 2009 8:39 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Deion Branch could have his salary restructured.
Not unheard of.
But I agree, Michael Crabtree, at least at this point, is a luxury that the Seahawks don’t need.
Weez the juice!!
by Carl Shinyama on Apr 7, 2009 8:50 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
What if he doesn't?
Do we ship him off for pennies like we did Peterson? That’s talent we’re marginalizing, because Branch can bring it.
"Part, fools!
Put up your swords. You know not what you do."
by Fearless Frog on Apr 7, 2009 8:53 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Wouldn't surprise me in the slightest.
But there’s a possibility that they could actually get something in return, too. I do agree that, the standard disclaimer about his health aside, he can bring it.
Problem is, he hasn’t brought it enough to fully deserve his salary, which is why I wouldn’t be surprised to see his salary restructured or the Seahawks disposing of him via trade or release.
Weez the juice!!
by Carl Shinyama on Apr 7, 2009 9:03 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Just like Stafford's a pick for the future
IMO, Crabtree’s the same. He looks like over-kill in ’09, but in ’10 it may look like a brilliant move.
Say Burleson’s not quite the same, or Branch continues to be brittle or just doesn’t produce in accordance with his contract, or Housh ages quickly (all of which are realistic scenarios). Having a young stud #1 WR gives you options to shed one of those guys or flip them ala Julian Peterson for anything in return.
When it comes to draft need, I don’t like to try and project the roster out too many seasons down the road. Because things change quickly, and what looks like adequate depth at a position one year can easily become a barren wasteland the next.
by jteckmann on Apr 7, 2009 8:53 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Great point...
exactly the reason DT should still be in play as well. Kerney is aging, and Redding is a FA next year.
Bring Your Game, Leave Your Name.
by iverson2169 on Apr 7, 2009 9:09 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
meant DL
Bring Your Game, Leave Your Name.
by iverson2169 on Apr 7, 2009 9:15 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well that's why Ruskell takes care of the needs in free agency
so theoretically he doesn’ t need to look for a need and reach on a player. Crabtree could still be in the draft plans if the scouts/coaching staff like him. Housh is 32, and Branch always seems to be injured. Crabtree could be the offensive nightmare we’ve not had, and he could be a cornerstone of the offense for 10+years.
And with the TJ Housh signing, it’s not like we’d need to force Crabtree onto the field until his foot has healed. He can get some later season snaps to prepare for the future.
Man I can’t wait for the draft.
by Trepidation on Apr 7, 2009 9:08 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Comparable WRs?
John, why did you choose those particular WRs to compare to Crabtree with regards to his completion percentage and yards per target? I mean, Crabtree looks fantastic by these comparisons, but how does he look compared to busts like Reggie Williams, Mike Williams, Charlie Rogers?
Misfit mentioned that it’s easy to see, just watching Crabtree highlight clips, that he’s a special football player. I would argue that Reggie Williams looked equally special in his UW days. I remember being in complete awe of Reggie – he made ridiculous plays and made them look easy. I don’t want Reggie on my team now…
by rossco17 on Apr 8, 2009 7:04 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
I'm with you
about Reggie Williams. He was a man amongst boys at UW.
by Misfit74 on Apr 8, 2009 8:43 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Crabtree 2008 > Reggie Williams 2003?
Reggie Williams is what scares the hell out of me when I think of the ‘Hawks taking Crabtree at #4. At one point, it seemed impossible that Reggie wouldn’t be a pro-bowler within 2 NFL years.
by rossco17 on Apr 8, 2009 8:52 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
This is correct.
Sometimes hindsight tends to diminish the enthusiasm many of us felt. I remember thinking Reggie was the quintessential “prototype WR” that we all now refer to in thinking about Crabtree. Absolutely no relevance to each other (save the high projections).
Bring Your Game, Leave Your Name.
by iverson2169 on Apr 8, 2009 11:38 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Except Reggie Williams' problems have nothing to do with his ability to play
As what we saw happen to Koren Robinson. If the head ain’t there, the body won’t follow. Can we say the same for Crabtree? It’s definitely possible, I don’t know, but there’s not enough indication so far to say he won’t be a hard worker.
by B.B.Finnegan on Apr 8, 2009 8:51 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Really?
“Except Reggie Williams’ problems have nothing to do with his ability to play”
I guess I don’t have a good idea as to why Reggie has failed so miserably in Jacksonville. But if it is his head (lack of desire, etc), isn’t that just another variable that talent evaluators needs to determine if it translates to the NFL? I mean, did Reggie display any head problems in college prior to the draft?
by rossco17 on Apr 8, 2009 9:04 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don't know enought say if he did or didn't
Does anyone know if Williams had any issues before the draft? He certainly did after, but my point is if you’re just going to throw out unfounded head-case concerns, unless you know them personally, it’s a possibility with any player and thus pretty impossible to identify and pointless to worry about.
by B.B.Finnegan on Apr 8, 2009 9:09 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
My point
is that why should look at these Yards per target and Completion percentage comparisons between Crabtree and a few NFL WRs? How does he stack up against some less successful NFL WRs? On the surface, it looks great, but unless we compare against many more NFL WRs, what conclusions can we draw from it?
BTW, John, I love reading these capsules. Thank you.
by rossco17 on Apr 8, 2009 10:24 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I agree rossco...
Too small a data set.
Bring Your Game, Leave Your Name.
by iverson2169 on Apr 8, 2009 11:40 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yes, he had issues.
And that’s why he slipped. He was considered top-of-the-line in talent, but a bit of a questionmark when it came to his head.
Crabtree, though, has absolutely no questions about his head. Apparently his dedication to the game is phenomenal, and that’s what I love about his potential. He seems like the antithesis of your stereotypical “me against the world” wide receiver.
by djafrot on Apr 8, 2009 11:43 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Reggie Williams was a douche all the way back in HS
You know what? Fuck you Sports Gods, fuck you.
by bluemax on Apr 8, 2009 1:14 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I picked those wide receivers because it's who I have data on.
I compile these stats by hand, and there is not a lot of college play-by-play data from more than a couple seasons ago.
by John Morgan on Apr 8, 2009 10:05 AM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
I have looked at nauseam as well...
It is a tedious exercise. Good job John.
Bring Your Game, Leave Your Name.
by iverson2169 on Apr 8, 2009 11:43 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
On Crabtree's roommate
The cocaine offense De’Shon was arrested for took place in New Mexico, in June. There were no drugs on him at the time, nor did they find any when they searched his apartment (and thus also Crabtree’s) at Texas Tech. The DEA was watching Crabtree’s apartment all that fall, which means if he’d have done anything wrong, he’d have been charged as well. How many other draft prospects had their apartment spied on for an entire semester and did nothing wrong the whole time? They didn’t even catch the roommate doing anything since the initial incident. Also they had another roommate, defensive end Brandon Sesay, does this me also now accuse him of being a coke head? Or maybe we wait to see if next year he becomes a top ten pick.
by B.B.Finnegan on Apr 8, 2009 8:33 AM PDT reply actions 0 recs
That's actually pretty impressive.
All semester, and not a single noise disturbance or underage drinker bust? The DEA would have used anything to search that place. They must have known they were being watched and were on their best behavior.
by Fear on Apr 8, 2009 1:39 PM PDT up reply actions 0 recs
Nobody is saying he did,
people are just saying that it is something to be considered. I do believe that “birds of a feather flock together”. Some social circles seem to have all the drama, while others do not have any. If he surrounds himself with questionable people, then to me he is questionable. I am not saying not to draft him, I am just saying there are tons of variables in drafting players, and that is one variable to consider.
by germpod on Apr 8, 2009 12:35 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
Hmm... is the Crabs bandwagon (Crabwagon) back in motion?
Clark @ Sportsline seems to think so: http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/draft/story/11604213
Funny how Crabtree was the consensus pick for Seattle back before TJ was signed, and then everything changed. But the point that TJ will probably only play 2 or three years is a great one, espcecially considering that Burly and Branch’s contracts will be maxing out pretty soon.
Who’s going to be catching passes for us in 2011? Certainly not a triumvirate of 30somethings Burly, TJ and Branch.
by djafrot on Apr 8, 2009 3:42 PM PDT reply actions 0 recs
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