Six and Fourteen
This is the most common draft order that I've been seeing. It's got the Seahawks at six, and then again at fourteen using Denver's pick.
We need to thank the nice people in Kansas City for beating Denver this weekend, which gave the 'Hawks a mid-teens pick instead of a pick down in the 18-20 range. Plus, Cleveland won on Sunday, which moved the Seahawks up from seven to six. Wasn't that nice of them?
So now we get to start rampant draft speculation. Who's that top-six player the 'Hawks get at #6? And then who do they look to get at fourteen and thirty-eight?
(If I might indulge in a little wishcasting of my own: I hope that the 'Hawks pick up a defensive lineman, an offensive lineman, and a quarterback with their top three picks. I'm less concerned about the order that they come up with 'em, but I think those are the three positions that the Seahawks need to invest in.)
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From what I've seen, Clausen is anywhere from 1 to 25.
It seems more often than not he is top 3 or 10 or later. I’m not sure if it was because the 4-10 picks didn’t need a QB or because people either like him or dislike him without much middle ground.
Bradford seems to be more in the range of 5-15 though any speculation is moot because he could be terrible at the combine or he could make every throw and vault to a number 3 pick (Assuming STL takes Suh and DET has no QB need).
Most people don’t have Gerald McCoy falling past 5 it seems.
Eric Berry is anywhere from a top 2 pick to a top 15 pick which seems reasonable since safeties aren’t picked early very often.
Okung seems to be the consensus best OT in the draft, though Anthony Davis from Rutgers is gaining on him.
I said before that there are 6 guys I’d like to get, and those 6 or so are: Clausen, Bradford, Okung, Suh, McCoy, and Berry. However, I think the next tier is ok as well and if we had to trade down I’d be ok, especially if one of the two QBs were still available. Haden, Dez Bryant, Anthony Davis, Derrick Morgan all seem like they could be good players at a much cheaper price.
DT, QB, or trade down is my preference.
Possible scenarios:
Super Dream.
6. Gerald McCoy
14. Clausen
38. Golden Tate/Carlos Dunlap
Realistic Dream
6. Clausen/Bradford
14. Dan Williams
38. Golden Tate
My Nightmare (but realistic, not horrible)
6. Eric Berry
14. Trent Williams
38. Tim Tebow
I don't want him either
but the reaction against him has become so strong I’m starting to hope he does really well. Wherever he goes; hopefully not here.
by jacobstevens on Jan 4, 2010 11:03 AM PST up reply actions
I really don't rate Clausen
And if Bradford shows his worth at the combine the Skins will take him before we get the chance. My dream;
6. McCoy
14. Spiller
38. Mallett
Possibly
But if he declares he’s coming off a stinking bowl game and could drop. He’s not starter ready but he’s got great height, good throwing motion and a strong arm.
Whoever becomes the consensus top quarterback will probably go top five
It’s tough to know whether Rams go with a quarterback or Suh. Hopefully QB, so we have a higher chance of getting Gerald McCoy. Berry will most likely be available at #6, and I wouldn’t be disappointed if we select him.
It’ll be interesting to see what we do with our 2nd first round pick because there are endless possibilities with that one. We could trade up and possibly get a top-tier talent like maybe Joe Haden or Derrick Morgan. We could trade down to grab someone like Charles Brown and get an extra 2nd rounder or 3rd rounder in the process.
Fun to dream this early...a lot will change by the end of April, though.
Bradford
Suh or G.McCoy
Spiller
/dream draft
Well I suppose it's kind of possible.
Spiller has an attitude problem and drops to 38 (or whatever our 2nd round pick is)
McCoy is deemed not as good and drops to 6.
Bradford’s arm is a concern and Snyder doesn’t want him, drops to 14.
This type of draft would make my head explode. Good, possible franchise QB? Check. Good, possibly best DT combo in the NFL? Check. BPA and explosive playmaker? Check.
I wasn't ruling out anything.
Trade ups; trades of future picks; and/or players falling could all result in this fantasy. More likely, I prefer we secure our future QB and even entertain the idea of trading up to get him. Pre-draft stuff may change that opinion, but right now that is a favored possibility in my mind.
What about a LT?
Let me preface this by saying that I am not a Hasslebeck homer and think he is part of the problem as well …
But I heard on the radio this morning that Hasslebeck had something like ~1.7 seconds to drop back and pass yesterday; whereas VY had over 3 (being a direct indication of the issues with our line). I don’t think the interior of the line is our problem, it is more an issue with our tackles. Locklear I don’t think is a serviceable LT and is better suited for the right side with Willis the first guy off the bench.
So where are we going to get a LT from? Anthony Davis is drawing comparisons to Ryan Clady and is apparently shooting up the draft boards with his performance. I think he would be a nice addition to our line. Keeping all else in tact, they would just need time to grow together and they could be a very good unit.
My personal feelings on the matter is that the o-line needs to be addressed, but
I don’t buy the premium LT is important argument. I just want my lineman to not be around average.
As for the time argument, I saw a few plays where the o-line looked terrible (some of it was an overloaded blitz to which our scheme had no answer for for some reason), but I’m not sure I buy the 1.7 seconds fact since I noted a few occasions where Hasselbeck double clutched, looked confused and took 5+ seconds to make a decision.
If my memories correct, I think there are quite a few left tackles entering free agency
There are virtually no running backs and no quarterbacks and no defensive tackles. I think we need to find a left tackle in free agency and use the draft for the rest.
After Marcus McNiel there isn't much
and I doubt McNiel actually hits FA. Also, remember that a lot of UFA’s will become RFA’s this year. So addressing any needs in free agency could be very difficult this year.
That's your first problem
You listened to the radio.
I watched most of the game, and saw many plays where Hasselbeck had 3-4 seconds of protection.
Just watch: when we have a playmaker at QB, our o-line will magically be a lot better. I wonder why.
The demise of the Broncos in '09 is our future. Pray hard.
I dunno ...
I mean I am sure that stat is grossly overstated, but it doesn’t change the fact that a good LT would upgrade our line immensely and help groom a young QB (and help prevent him from turning into D. Carr).
Can't argue with that!
I’m hoping for a dominant DT (Gerald McCoy, anyone?) to pair with Mebane.
If he’s the real deal, our defense will instantly get better: pass rush, pass defense, rush defense, etc.
Then use our pick @ 14 to get a QB. Maybe use our #40 pick for a LT.
The demise of the Broncos in '09 is our future. Pray hard.
If a QB falls to 14 that'd be great.
Otherwise it looks like it might have to be Clausen/Bradford at 6, Williams/Cody/Price at 14ish, which would be pretty good in my opinion as well.
Yes yes yes!!!!
With an above average QB, I don’t think we need an elite LT.
6 – Gerald McCoy
14 – Clausen/Bradford
40 – Tackle
= sex
The demise of the Broncos in '09 is our future. Pray hard.
I remember something from last year.
Didn’t it get established (by John) that QBs that succeed are most often drafted early in the first round while successful players at other positions it isn’t as critical as it is QB? I wonder if we can’t find an excellent DT later in the draft. I don’t know that we can pass up one of the top QBs with our first pick, given the draft history of both positions. I’ll have to do some more digging to confirm this, but that is my recollection.
Yeah, like, say, Malcolm Sheppard in the 4th round.
DE from Arkansas that switched to tackle, really good interior pass rush, good handfighting, 3 year starter.
Like Mebane?
:P
I’m only high on a DT in the first round because they’re more of a sure thing, and I truly believe another dominant DT will transform our defense.
The demise of the Broncos in '09 is our future. Pray hard.
John talked about the best quarterbacks coming out of the first round
Which, you know, Suprise! I don’t remember anything about other positions not seeing the same results.
Jesus.
Took me 8 reads to find the mistake.
Bird Law in this country isn't governed by reason.
by Tyler Jorgensen on Jan 5, 2010 7:04 PM PST up reply actions
since Suh seems unlikely
I am on the bandwagon for praying that G. McCoy drops. Free up Mebane to rush the passer more and add a projected elite DT next to him. Our pass rush improves already and thats before factoring in that we could resign Tapp and give him the snaps Kerney got this year.
I don't know why McCoy would drop.
He’s 99% the player that Suh is, and I think he’s younger. I’d be stunned if he wasn’t taken in the first 3 picks.
God I hope we dont get a GM that does something stupid
like package our picks to move up for a player he’s just gotta have or trade either of them for some player he had in ____ where he was last.
We could potentially really turn it around with 6, 14, 38 and new coaching.
If that package is for Suh... I might not complain.
Talents that I covet:
Ndamukong Suh, Gerald McCoy, Sam Bradford, Mike Iupati, Golden Tate, Earl Thomas, and Freddie Barnes
by Carl Shinyama on Jan 4, 2010 8:42 PM PST up reply actions
NO
We have to many needs to put all our chips in one basket. If who we want can be gotten later then trade down and get more picks
ZORN FOR OC
You take talent where you can get it.
I find it funny that for someone who wants Zorn for offensive coordinator, you’re opposed to the idea of trading up to get Suh.
Talents that I covet:
Ndamukong Suh, Gerald McCoy, Sam Bradford, Mike Iupati, Golden Tate, Earl Thomas, and Freddie Barnes
by Carl Shinyama on Jan 4, 2010 10:05 PM PST up reply actions
And really, people need to stop with this idea that the Seahawks have an abundance of needs.
They merely need elite talent at key positions, which in this case, are: QB, LT, and DT.
Talents that I covet:
Ndamukong Suh, Gerald McCoy, Sam Bradford, Mike Iupati, Golden Tate, Earl Thomas, and Freddie Barnes
by Carl Shinyama on Jan 4, 2010 10:06 PM PST up reply actions
lol It does make it sound like an oversimplified diagnosis.
Talents that I covet:
Ndamukong Suh, Gerald McCoy, Sam Bradford, Mike Iupati, Golden Tate, Earl Thomas, and Freddie Barnes
by Carl Shinyama on Jan 4, 2010 10:44 PM PST up reply actions
What does my wanting Zorn for OC have to do with drafting
I have not seen anything remotely good with Knapps offensive schemes so I think a change is in order. Zorn was an assistant to Holmgren who has had a lot of assistants become good offensive coachs. Maybe Zorn is the next one.
ZORN FOR OC
If you think it has something to do with drafting, you are mistaken.
I was merely (there it is again) pointing out the irony that for someone who thinks Zorn for OC is a good idea, you happen don’t think trading up for an elite talent like Suh is a good idea.
Talents that I covet:
Ndamukong Suh, Gerald McCoy, Sam Bradford, Mike Iupati, Golden Tate, Earl Thomas, and Freddie Barnes
by Carl Shinyama on Jan 4, 2010 10:56 PM PST up reply actions
One elite player or patching several holes
I just don’t like the idea of picking up one so called elite player when we are in position to patch several holes. Does anyone remember another so called elite big 12 talent that went by the name of bosworth. There are no sure deals in the draft so we should get more better players then chance one elite player
ZORN FOR OC
You realize that rebuilding the Seahawks is going to be a process that spans several years, right?
Therefore, you get talent where you can get it. Sure, there are no sure deals in the draft, but there are talents that can transcend a team and be a cornerstone of the franchise, and Suh is exactly that. I never said that he was a sure deal, but he is a highly coveted talent, and justifiably so.
This isn’t a period where Seattle has to “patch several holes”. This is a period where they need to acquire cornerstone/franchise talent at key positions. Once they’ve established that, then allow for patching any holes that they may need to patch.
Also, while you are arguing quantity vs. quality based on risks, you must also account for the potential rewards and whether it far outweighs the risk. Suh is one such talent that justifies such an argument.
Talents that I covet:
Ndamukong Suh, Gerald McCoy, Sam Bradford, Mike Iupati, Golden Tate, Earl Thomas, and Freddie Barnes
by Carl Shinyama on Jan 4, 2010 11:21 PM PST up reply actions
I do realize this will not happen over night
I also know that we have not had a lot of luck in drafting sure things. How many of our 1st round picks have actually turned out as cornerstones for us.
ZORN FOR OC
Do names like Walter Jones, Shaun Alexander, and Steve Hutchinson ring a bell?
I could pick more, but I will stop there.
Talents that I covet:
Ndamukong Suh, Gerald McCoy, Sam Bradford, Mike Iupati, Golden Tate, Earl Thomas, and Freddie Barnes
by Carl Shinyama on Jan 4, 2010 11:32 PM PST up reply actions
I agree on Jones and Alexander
But I don’t believe Hutch is our cornerstone. Isn’t he in Minnasota. I will give you we have had good fortunes with some but somehow we seem to get a lot of so called talent that just don’t pan out for one reason or another. The higher we pick the less luck we seem to have. Rick Mirer comes to mind.
ZORN FOR OC
You will notice that the management organization that drafted Mirer is no longer here.
Hell, the ownership group that drafted Mirer is no longer here.
Thank you Mr Paul Allen
I just hope we can get a GM in here that can evaluate talent and make good choices in both players and coaches.
ZORN FOR OC
You're looking at the end result and dismissing what was a cornerstone talent.
Hutchinson was a cornerstone player for the Seahawks. The Seahawks drafted him, therefore, he turned out to be a cornerstone for the Seahawks. That he left the Seahawks doesn’t negate that fact.
Talents that I covet:
Ndamukong Suh, Gerald McCoy, Sam Bradford, Mike Iupati, Golden Tate, Earl Thomas, and Freddie Barnes
by Carl Shinyama on Jan 5, 2010 7:59 AM PST up reply actions
Am I the only one that thinks Boz had a solid career, albeit a short one?!?
Bird Law in this country isn't governed by reason.
by Tyler Jorgensen on Jan 5, 2010 9:39 AM PST up reply actions
Boz has an incredibly bad rap.
Mostly over the Bo Jackson incident. I don’t think any linebacker, past or present, could have made that stop.
It's Great to be a Florida Gator!
"I never met a llama I didn't like." - TJ Duckett
All I want for Christmas is Joe Haden, Eric Berry, and Nandamukong Suh in Seahawks blue.
by Wayward Llama on Jan 5, 2010 10:33 AM PST up reply actions
Let's not forget he DID stop him solo...
He stopped a full head of steam BO, while he was moving laterally, it just took him about 3 yards. That’s not exactly terrible, it’s just that they met at the one yard line.
Bird Law in this country isn't governed by reason.
by Tyler Jorgensen on Jan 5, 2010 11:23 AM PST up reply actions
Also-- most overrated play and oft cited despite its lack of truth in retelling EVER.
Bird Law in this country isn't governed by reason.
by Tyler Jorgensen on Jan 5, 2010 11:24 AM PST up reply actions
Why do we need elite talent at DT?
There’s a lot of you guys drooling about these DTs. I’m curious. Please tell me more.
by jacobstevens on Jan 5, 2010 10:11 AM PST up reply actions
our 2nd round pick is #40
not #38. We rotate positions round to round with the other 5-11 teams. Still that isn’t much of a difference.
Wow. 3 picks in the top 40.
I’m sure everyone knows this, but holy crap this draft is going to be huge and hopefully fun.
New GM should be prepared to Trade Down
There may be one guy the team loves at #6, but if they don’t see their sure-fire starting QB or sure-fire starting OT available at that spot, they should consider the large number of needs this team has (starters at QB, OT, OG, SS, FS, RB, DE, DT, and depth at TE and CB).
We all should recognize that most NFL starters and Pro Bowlers were not first-round draft picks, that all first round picks are considered “certain” prospects, and that several of these every year are expensive BUSTS.
Three picks in the top 40 can be turned into five picks in the top 60. Mr. GM, go get us five prospects.
"Football players are temperamental. That's 90 percent temper and 10 percent mental." - Doug Plank
A pretty strong argument could be made to attempt and move up the draft instead.
Potentially the last year of large rookie contracts? There are going to be teams in the first five selections who are going to want out. Seattle could cover the cost by cutting ties with Hasselbeck and Jones.
Maybe it's not possible because it's the Rams
But I can’t see both Clausen and Bradford off by our pick, and the Rams NEED a QB. How realistic would it be to move up by moving a player (Branch, Burl, Jones), next year’s second rounder, and our top first to move to 1?
Maybe that’s just me fantasizing and being unrealistic.
It probably is.
After Suh's game against Texas, I find it hard to think STL won't take him.
Sure they need a QB, but they kind of have a need at every position.
Agree. Especially with spags at the helm, and his history w/ D-lines
The demise of the Broncos in '09 is our future. Pray hard.
My ideal realistic draft:
6: Eric Berry
14: Arrellious Benn
38: Charles Brown or Brian Baluga, whomever’s there.
Ugh, no Eric Berry
our Safeties aren’t the problem, our lack of pass rush is the problem. Use that pick on a DT to beef up our interior line, with Mebane, and our newfound pass rush will make our secondary look awesome.
The demise of the Broncos in '09 is our future. Pray hard.
I agree with your premise.
However, I’d say that Berry is substantially better than any other player at that position. I’d love to get Suh (0% chance) Or Gerald Mccoy (Not going to fall past 5.) After that for me, it’s Eric Berry or Joe Haden.
That is unless you want a QB, which is probably my 2nd favorite scenario
With getting Berry or Haden as my first.
Using a high first rounder for the as of yet NFL unproven Barry reminds me that Bernard Pollard was available for free midseason.
Damn damn damn.
Bird Law in this country isn't governed by reason.
by Tyler Jorgensen on Jan 4, 2010 7:47 PM PST up reply actions
It's premature to say that McCoy won't fall past #5.
Talents that I covet:
Ndamukong Suh, Gerald McCoy, Sam Bradford, Mike Iupati, Golden Tate, Earl Thomas, and Freddie Barnes
by Carl Shinyama on Jan 4, 2010 8:44 PM PST up reply actions
I'm just nsaying that the only way I see us taking a WR at 14 is if
Bryant is on the board.
Benn just has too many red flags. Maybe if he falls to our 2nd.
Berry is over-rated
He lacks in run support and sometimes disappears in games. I’d consider him at #14, but taking safety in the top 10 is a lot like taking a 4-3 LB that high, they would have to be all-pros to justify the investment.
Benn is listed as a 2nd/3rd round draft pick right now by most. He had a horrible 2009 season and displayed awful hands.
Bulaga gave up 3 sacks in the first half of the Michigan game. Even at RT, I’m not sure he’d be an upgrade over Ray Willis. Bulaga might be worth drafting as a guard. Bulaga and Brown will both likely be 1st round picks.
by kearly on Jan 4, 2010 10:29 PM PST up reply actions 1 recs
Benn had Juice Williams as his quarterback
thats pretty much the only difference I can see between him and Bryant.
I don't think I buy into the idea that a poor QB lets a WR off the hook
Benn had a big problem with drops this season, and you can’t blame a QB for that. This year Hasselbeck was horrible but Nate Burleson had the 2nd highest yardage total of his career, and Housh still put up a respectable total not far from our expectations.
I watched some game tape of Benn and at times he looks really sharp, but most of the time he seems lazy on his routes and giving maybe 80% effort. He has solid size/speed, but I’m not seeing a guy with a heart for the game. Bryant is a little bit of a diva, but he plays hard on the football field. I’m not sure I’d draft either of them, but I’d feel a lot more confident with Bryant panning out. As a general rule, I avoid “raw” or project players with low starting points and high ceilings in rounds 1 and 2. In that early stage of the draft, you can get a much safer pick that is every bit as good in most cases.
Well theres the Roddy White example for players who've had drops with one QB and not another
I’m not sure if theres a ton of other examples though.
I’m not sure why Benn would be considered raw. He was productive with a bad QB and an average team his first two years and fell off a cliff when his team got awful. Bryant and Benn actually had very similar freshman and sophomore years with the exception of touchdowns. Dez did it in a very pass friendly offense, Benn wasn’t so fortunate.
Dream draft
6: Tim Tebow
14: Tim Tebow
40: Tim Tebow
by GarethLewin on Jan 4, 2010 9:47 PM PST reply actions 1 recs
Threediculous.
Bird Law in this country isn't governed by reason.
by Tyler Jorgensen on Jan 5, 2010 9:39 AM PST up reply actions
Most mocks I've seen have Clausen going #1 to the Rams
and I consider that HIGHLY UNLIKELY. Bulger is only 32, half way through a 6 year contract and until 2007 put up good numbers. I think Scott Lennihan, who was fired last year (Sep 2008) had something to do with the entire offenses decline. Boller was only signed for 1 year and should be released, but Keith Null, rookie out of West Texas A&M didn’t play that poorly in 4 games if you throw out his first start against the Titans where he threw 5 picks. His completion percentage has been a respectable 65%, about 10 points better than Bulger or Boller. I think Bulger will be under center next year with Null as his backup, and the Rams will pickup a mid to late round QB prospect to compete with Null for the future starting job. The team is still for sale, may move to LA, and there is no way they are going to encumber the team with a huge rookie QB contract now given all of that, the economy, the CBA status and expectation of a rookie pay scale in 2011. Therefore:
Rams take Suh
Lions take McCoy (they are happy with Jeff Backus at LT)
Bucs take Dunlap (despite issues, still flashes dominance with huge upside)
Skins take Bradford (if healthy, accuracy is elite)
Chiefs take Campbell (good pass pro but excellent run blocker)
Hawks can choose between Morgan, Haden, Okung, Davis and Berry. I prefer Okung or Morgan. If Morgan, then Kerney goes. If Okung, then Locklear moves back to RT. Locklear was an OG prospect out of NC State that moved to RT when Floyd Womack was injured in pre-season, so Seattle already got their moneys worth with his 3rd round contract, and I just think this is a great example of the Peter Principle. He needs to move back to RT instead of continuing to languish at LT.
At 14 we should be able to choose between Spiller, Mays, Bulaga or Pierre-Paul (and maybe even Berry). I would prefer Spiller. Some say he’s a luxury, but he would contribute in the return game immediately, and if Knapp (or the new OC) finds ways to get him touches like Philly does with Jackson, he will be a difference maker on a slow team without a dynamic playmaker. If we don’t get Spiller, I’d at least like a big CB like Perrish Cox at #40 who is a dynamic returner in his own right, and could play nickel and replace Jennings in time (or immediately).
Until I have reason to believe we’re moving to more 3-4, which has been suggested a lot, I can’t see a nose tackle like Williams or Cody.
As for QB, unless Clausen, Mallett or McCoy present good value late in the 1st or early 2nd, I don’t favor forcing the issue and reaching. I still prefer a trade scenario to land a QB prospect, but would rather go into 2011 with Hass and Seneca than dump either of them for any of the prospects in this draft. If Bradford checks out and miraculously falls to us at 6, I could live with that, but unless Hass restructures his deal as part of an extension to clear cap space, I can’t see carrying both he and Bradford on the roster next year.
Good stuff
We could always leapfrog the Skins to get Bradford. With a rookie salary cap probably coming soon, teams in the top 5 will have more incentive than ever to trade down, and that could create a buyers market. Moving up 3 spots should not cost much, TB will probably be sitting there after Suh and McCoy were taken off the board wondering what to do, and a deal to move down 3 spots would be enticing.
I do think the Rams will be looking for a QB, but they could still get a decent 2nd tier QB with their next pick, or they could move up with that 2nd pick and get Clausen if he falls.
If the draft were today, Dunlap probably wouldn’t even be a 1st rounder, so its hard to see him going #3. He might pull and Andre Smith and back his way into the top 10, but I’d say that’s unlikely at this point. The off the field stuff made people realize that Dunlap hasn’t been all that great on the field either.
Everything else is pretty solid. I don’t agree with all of it perfectly, but its not too far from my feelings and is well explained.
I think your reasoning behind the Rams not taking Clausen is solid.
Okung, I’ve become lukewarm towards him recently. He is capable of dominating, but apparently, he will lapse in his effort, laughably so, from time to time.
With your scenario, I’d rather trade down from #6. Pittsburgh might still be a candidate to trade down if they really want Berry, but I think at their position, they can stay pat and wait for Earl Thomas. Other than them, I have no idea who would want to trade up to Seattle’s spot.
I can actually see Seattle keeping Bradford and Hasselbeck without restructuring Hasselbeck’s contract, so long as certain player’s contracts are restructured or terminated.
Talents that I covet:
Ndamukong Suh, Gerald McCoy, Sam Bradford, Mike Iupati, Golden Tate, Earl Thomas, and Freddie Barnes
by Carl Shinyama on Jan 4, 2010 10:53 PM PST up reply actions
The Rams have a lot of holes to fill, I could see them trading down.
Especially in such a deep draft.
Agree.
At this point, I don’t think any of the ‘pundits’ believe any of the QBs available are worthy of the first pick.
The demise of the Broncos in '09 is our future. Pray hard.
Rams are getting sold, management was cleaned out, they have problems top to bottom.
They need a face for the franchise, a face for the future. They have no QB. It’s impossible to count QB out for them. Impossible.
by jacobstevens on Jan 5, 2010 10:15 AM PST up reply actions
Here are the players I'm eyeballing at each pick that have a realistic chance of being there
#6: Sam Bradford/Derrick Morgan/Joe Haden
#14: Mike Iupati/Charles Brown/Brian Price/Eric Berry/Dez Bryant/Earl Thomas/CJ Spiller
#40: Jahvid Best/Javier Arenas/Carlos Dunlap/Greg Hardy/Jonathan Dwyer/Joseph Barksdale/Jason Fox/Morgan Burnett
Bradford probably won’t be had without trading up, so my realistic best case scenario without moving a pick would be Morgan/Iupati/Best. If Arenas falls into the 3rd round, I’d consider trading up to get him. He reminds me a lot of Josh Wilson (same size, ball skills, an even better return specialist).
Its really tough to not draft a QB or LT with one of those premium picks, but the talent just isn’t there this year and I’m a big believer that you draft the player, not the position. I like Brown and Bradford, but other than those two, I’m not terribly excited about any other 1st round QB or LT prospect. WR is pretty fallow as well.
There is some really nice talent in this draft if Seattle is willing to address the smaller needs this year. Haden is a stud CB, Iupati is a monster guard who is such a good athlete that he might be able to transition to RT. Morgan can be that elite pass rusher Seattle desperately needs if its going to stay 4-3. Best is a lot like Spiller as a runner, and can take a bigger workload. Brian Price is a 3 tech Mebane. I’d love to get any of those guys. They strike me as safe picks (Morgan being the mildly risky of the bunch simply because of his position) with pro-bowl upside.
I also like Haden a lot
and if Trufant isn’t expected to return to pro-bowl form, he could fill a huge need. Still, one thing that bothers me is having too much money tied up in one position, like our linebackers for instance, and adding an expensive Haden to Trufants contract makes my wallet itch. While I hate the idea of dealing young stud players, I wonder if Curry could be dealt for a high first round pick. I see his strength as rush 3-4 OLB, and for teams like KC and Cleveland with a big need in that area, I wonder if they’d trade their #5 or #7 for Curry.
No Golden Tate?
Talents that I covet:
Ndamukong Suh, Gerald McCoy, Sam Bradford, Mike Iupati, Golden Tate, Earl Thomas, and Freddie Barnes
by Carl Shinyama on Jan 5, 2010 7:55 AM PST up reply actions
My thoughts too. I love Kearly's list, but Golden Tate is a big omission.
Also, the people who aren’t high on Clausen, is there any particular reason? Pro offense. 7:1 td int ratio. #1 prospect in high school. Played with toe injury all season. I don’t want him with the number 1 pick, but number 6 or 14? I’m definitely thinking about it.
Hell, yeah.
Think he’ll fall to six? I find it hard to believe the ‘skins won’t draft a QB. The Rams, possibly, too.
The demise of the Broncos in '09 is our future. Pray hard.
At #6?
I’ll take him!
But I don’t really think he’s necessarily a franchise QB. A lot of people think so, but having watched him a little both last year and this year, but I’ve seen some erratic play from him where it doesn’t add up to the hype about him being the elite quarterback that he’s made out to be. Yes, he has the tools, but his play can be erratic throughout the entire 60 minutes. Bradford, on the other hand, can dominate a game for the entire game, and do it again the following week. That’s not to say that Clausen isn’t capable of it. His game has grown tremendously from last year to this year, and he is definitely capable of continuing that growth in the pro’s, though some speed bumps are to be expected.
However, one thing that I love, love, love about Clausen is that he is very football smart. His reads are fluid, the progressions are quick, and he has a very good ability to anticipate his receiver (usually Golden Tate, but who could blame him?). Also, I love how he tends to be calm in crunch time. I wasn’t overly impressed by his performance overall in the game against the Huskies this past year, but late in the game, he turned it the fuck on!
But at #6? He’s definitely worth the trouble there.
Talents that I covet:
Ndamukong Suh, Gerald McCoy, Sam Bradford, Mike Iupati, Golden Tate, Earl Thomas, and Freddie Barnes
by Carl Shinyama on Jan 5, 2010 9:36 PM PST up reply actions
Something to keep in mind
when considering the idea of trading up for a QB. We’d be moving 3 spots up, with Tampa, and it would probably cost our 2nd round pick. The Browns accepted less last year, but Tampa’s probably got their eye on one of the DTs and it’s more costly for them this year, to move down.
I read Seahawk's Draft Blog a fair bit
so I’m kinda nervous about the QB’s, and don’t feel there’s a dominant tackle worth the 6th overall pick. That said, guys I would like to see in Seahawks Blue are
Gerald McCoy (DT)
Derrick Morgan (DE)
CJ Spiller (RB)
Joe Haden (CB)<-pay note, one of the very rare times I would suggest a Florida Gator.
Mike Iupati (OG)
Jahvid Best (RB)
I’m scared about Eric Berry, he always goes for the feet when trying to tackle running backs. He never goes up high.
Taylor Mays is just a big hitter, doesn’t try to read offenses or make plays on the ball
If Charles Brown can bulk up and still be as athletic, he’ll rise on draft boards.
Clausen.. read this
Colt McCoy: 5 yard slants and bubble screens. Questionable arm strength.
I’m not really sold on any of the LT’s, QB’s, or first round receivers. That said, things will probably change at the combine/senior bowl/other things like that.
Interesting take, thanks for that
I’m pulling hard for McCoy (assuming he doesn’t have a disastrous combine, or something).
It’ll be easier to retain Mebane when he becomes a free agent after next season if he’s playing with an elite DT next to him.
If I were him, I’d want the hell out of here. He’s getting no help.
The demise of the Broncos in '09 is our future. Pray hard.
We should really take both McCoys
Then we’d get all kinds of McCoy to Deon, Deon and McCoy on the stop, which would be a great experience for those listening on radio.
by B.B.Finnegan on Jan 5, 2010 11:27 AM PST up reply actions
What about Rico or Anthony?
We don’t need a LB or a TE, but what the heck might as well complete the quadfecta, right?
Not sure I agree it'd be easier to retain Mebane that way.
Seems it could make his stats explode, therefor make him more expensive to keep…
Bird Law in this country isn't governed by reason.
by Tyler Jorgensen on Jan 5, 2010 11:25 AM PST up reply actions
Clausen was dealing with a toe injury that may or may not have lead to him throwing off his back foot
The 3/4 throwing motion concerns are over rated I think. He doesn’t usually thow at 3/4, he mostly does it when he’s on the run, and theres nothing to show that that throwing motion is an impediment to NFL success.
It’s odd that he criticizes Clausen’s ability to throw the screen since most people knock Clausen for too many screens and dump offs leading to his passing yards.
To me Clausen is a quarterback with an average arm, above average accuracy, and solid speed in his release who has played his entire college career in an incredibly complicated pro system. Most teams running a pro offense in college are just basing their head against a wall, Clausen was highly productive with few turn overs. Sure he had great receivers but he also had no running game, a poor offensive line and a bad defense that forced him to frequently play from behind.
I have a hard time seeing Clausen beeing worse than average in the pro’s. He might not have the upside of Matt Stafford, he’s more like Sanchez without the downside.
I think that's a pretty good description of him.
I see his prospects as Alex Smith on the low end and Aaron Rodgers on the high end. Subjectively/emotionally I’m still more interested in him than Bradford.
I'd read the Clausen post, when Rob posted it.
A bit overly negative, I think. Just watching Clausen in other games shows that you can’t be so myopic about this kind of stuff.
I was liking Clausen better than Bradford, for a month, now. Lower ceiling, but higher floor. More pro ready. Bradford’s offense and protection rarely gave him pro-style pockets, to see how he’d move in the pocket; so often all the action was lateral in front of him. Against Florida, some slight, awkward adjustments as he threw occurred on the interceptions. Although I liked how fluidly and instantaneously he adjusted to get the ball out, over the lineman’s raised arms that only went up mid-release, and the ball still remained accurate. But overall I worried about his response to real pro pressure.
I’ve come to see why Bradford is the better prospect, though. Still has a lower floor. But not such a difference to give Clausen the edge. The higher ceiling gives Bradford the edge.
But back to Staton, if Clausen were such an easily dismissable prospect he wouldn’t be in the top 5.
by jacobstevens on Jan 5, 2010 12:58 PM PST up reply actions
Possible trade up for Bradford:
According to the chart on this site:
http://www.draftcountdown.com/features/Value-Chart.php
The Seahawks 6th pick is worth 1,600 and our 38th is worth 520 which added together is 2,120. If the Seahawks are looking to draft a QB (specifically Bradford), they should try and trade up to the 3rd pick in the draft (worth 2,200) before Washington can take him.
If both Suh and McCoy are off the board and Tampa doesn’t have anyone that they love, the Seahawks could package the 6th, 38th, and some later round pick to trade up.
That would mean the Seahawks would effectively be losing their 2nd and probably 4th or 5th round picks to draft Bradford.
Tampa is obviously rebuilding and my thought is they will jump at the opportunity to draft more talent. The Seahawks seem to need elite talent which Bradford could provide.
Just a possibility. Thoughts?
With these quarterbacks I'd much rather the Hawks gamble that one slides to 14
than spend resources trading up to get one.
Agreed.
Bird Law in this country isn't governed by reason.
by Tyler Jorgensen on Jan 5, 2010 7:07 PM PST up reply actions
Well, since you asked for thoughts,
I’m pretty adamant about not trading up. Especially if you’re a bad team. You’d have to be pretty sure that Bradford is that much better than Clausen because if he’s not, then you just made a bad trade. If you’re hesitant to place one above the other than you just draft whichever one falls to 6, then draft Tate, Gilyard, Ras I Dowling, or some guy who happens to fall (Everette Brown, Eben Britton type.
Agreed.
Bird Law in this country isn't governed by reason.
by Tyler Jorgensen on Jan 5, 2010 7:07 PM PST up reply actions
Good point.
I’m generally sketchy about trading up however, I firmly believe that the Seahawks need a new QB next year or some sort of miracle. Every good team in the NFL has a quality QB and why not try and get our QB for the future?
I would hope the Seahawks would do this only if they firmly believe that Bradford will become a good QB if not an elite one (it will obviously depend on his shoulder, how he works out, etc.)
If the Seahawks are planning on completely re-building though, it would obviously be a stupid move and we should get all the talent we possibly can by keeping our draft picks and possibly trading for more.
by killacamkilla2 on Jan 5, 2010 8:58 PM PST up reply actions
Good perspective.
And I also keep looking not at good teams, but good runs. The top teams of a decade, perennial SB contenders. They don’t just have god QB play, but top QBs in a generation. The Ravens are the best antithesis, having sustained success in spite of a lack of good QB play. But most other defense-first teams were short lived, and always still had good guys like Brad Johnson and Jim McMahon. The Steelers had Bradshaw, Swann, Stallworth, they weren’t defense-only.
I try to cut through the paralysis by overanalysis. If you don’t have a QB, you go get one. Don’t stop til you find one. I will be a broken record on this until we get the next guy. It’s not common to go from Montana to Young, when you have a good QB it often takes a few to get the next good franchise QB. We’re one year late on the search if not two, so stop the silliness and get at it, I say.
by jacobstevens on Jan 6, 2010 12:51 PM PST up reply actions
Seahawks have the 40th pick, not the 38th.
Talents that I covet:
Ndamukong Suh, Gerald McCoy, Sam Bradford, Mike Iupati, Golden Tate, Earl Thomas, and Freddie Barnes
by Carl Shinyama on Jan 5, 2010 9:40 PM PST up reply actions
I want Bradford more than any other prospect.
However, if both quarterbacks are available at #4, I am confident that one of them, likely Bradford, will be available to Seattle at #6, simply because even though Washington will likely select a quarterback (which I believe would be Clausen), the Chiefs already have invested in Cassel, and are not likely to take a Quarterback prospect, therefore making either Clausen or Bradford available to the Seahawks at #6.
The wild card is St. Louis, and there’s reason to believe that they may not select a quarterback at #1. If they don’t take a quarterback, the aforementioned scenario, at this point, is not only possible, but probable.
Talents that I covet:
Ndamukong Suh, Gerald McCoy, Sam Bradford, Mike Iupati, Golden Tate, Earl Thomas, and Freddie Barnes
by Carl Shinyama on Jan 5, 2010 9:52 PM PST up reply actions
Yes that would be horrible.
I believe that the majority of scouts (including Washington’s) will label Bradford as the clearly superior prospect. Clausen is too much of a reach at 6 which is why I think the Seahawks should consider moving up.
In my dream scenario:
McCoy or Bradford would fall to #6.
Clausen falls to #14
We trade some later picks to move up and get Spiller in the middle of the first round.
by killacamkilla2 on Jan 5, 2010 11:21 PM PST up reply actions
Oakland, Cleveland, Buffalo and Jacksonville all pick between 6 and 14 and could be in the market for a QB
If the Hawks decide that either Clausen or Bradford is their guy and one is available at 6, they really should take him there. And its likely one will be available because only Washington and St Louis are possibilities to draft a QB before 6 and right now I agree that St Louis will go in a different direction in round 1.
Spiller will likely be available at 14 but then the question becomes Spiller, or a potential starting LT because none of R Okung, A Davis, B Campbell, or C Brown will likely be available in round 2 and from what I’ve read B Baluga and T Williams project more as a RT (and still could be gone by 40.).
I’m not sure which direction I would want them to go at this point, but there is no denying Spiller’s explosiveness and play making ability.
There's zero reason to pass on either QB at 6
neither are risky enough to justify it, like with Sanchez.
by jacobstevens on Jan 6, 2010 12:39 PM PST up reply actions
I agree that something like this has to be considered.
If the Seahawks are high on Bradford as a QB of the future (and present, sorry Matt), then do what it takes to get your guy. QB is the single most important position in football. Don’t screw around and settle for a guy you don’t want or don’t think highly of. Trade up and get Bradford, if you think he’s the best QB in the draft, esp. if you think it’s not close.
How much better
How much better are Bradford and Clausen then the next 5 QB prospects. Is there a lot of difference or are these 2 just the top of a average class of QB’s. If you can get another prospect that is close to these to later wouldn’t it be worth it.
ZORN FOR OC
Clausen and Bradford are definitely the top tier of this quarterback class
After them you have some mix of Canfield, who I really like, Mallet, if he declares, and McCoy.
Hate to drone on about him
But I still love the idea of aquiring Kolb. It doesn’t look like McNabb’s going anywhere soon and KK proved more than capable this year. The trade made a bit more sense when Denver were flying and it looked like our 2nd 1st-rounder would be in the mid to late 20’s. However, I still don’t really think pick 14 is too much to give up, especially if we’re contemplating spending pick 6 on Bradford or Clausen, both of whom are far from a sure thing. If the Hawks traded back pick 6 for an extra 2nd-3rd round pick, and gave up pick 14 from Kolb I’d find it hard to be upset
Forget it.
I had a long dialogue here with someone about it (I’m mostly against it), and went as far as to head over to the Eagles SB nation site and create a fanpost asking their thoughts.
Their thoughts are that he is unavailable, and it would take multiple high picks to get him from them— too high a price for a risky acquisition however promising.
You’d be more likely to get Donovan from them, particularly if they/he struggles in the playoffs.
Bird Law in this country isn't governed by reason.
by Tyler Jorgensen on Jan 6, 2010 7:19 AM PST up reply actions
McNabb is finishing his 11th season
If the Eagles really like Kolb, I wouldn’t be surprised if they sign him long term and cut loose McNabb after next year. McNabb and Hass have been in the league the same number of years. Why keep the aging vet who’s just going to get worse? Only a team like Seattle does that.
Hold up here.
I didn’t say I wanted McNabb, only that he would be more likely to be available.
Bird Law in this country isn't governed by reason.
by Tyler Jorgensen on Jan 6, 2010 4:58 PM PST up reply actions
I'm in the same camp as Jacobstevens on this...
I think we all agree that a franchise QB is the cornerstone of a winning team, and that a great QB is the cornerstone of a championship team.
With this having been said, I liken the Seahawks situation to surviving in the desert on a canteen of water.
Number one rule: If you have water…. you drink it. So often people are found dead in the desert with water left in the canteen (in an attempt to ration it). I think the same should apply here as well. You never know when that QB will come along. Instead of “rationing” the draft picks thinking that that QB will be available later…. you “drink” (go and get that franchise guy now).
Take a guy like Sam Bradford. The NFL draft is a “what-have-you-done-for-me-lately” affair. Guy’s that run great 40’s can vault several rounds (ie. Raiders safety in the second last year). The exact opposite can be said of Bradford. We are still talking about a QB projected anywhere from #1 – #10 having missed an entire season with injury. Historically, that type of situation can be a draft catastrophe for a prospect, and yet Bradford remains atop the draft boards. That’s how good he is. Should a guy like Bradford (or whoever grades out highest) be available at #6, I dont see anyway the Seahawks could pass that up. You then come back with your franchise caliber tackle at #14, and BPA at #40.
Bring Your Game, Leave Your Name.
When you say franchise caliber tackle, do you mean offensive or defensive?
I assume offensive, but I don’t know how much playing time a QB will get in his rookie year, especially if management doesn’t believe Hasselbeck is the problem. I’d rather get Dan Williams or Price at 14 and wait for a LT next year or get one through free agency.
As for Bradford vs. Clausen, Bradford has a shoulder concern as well as a Big 12 spread offense concern. If I’m drafting a QB, I’d prefer to draft one who has been in a pro system like Matt Ryan, Matt Stafford, any USC QB. I’d still love Bradford at 6, but I think Clausen has fewer question marks.
Yes.... I meant offensive tackle.
I also wouldn’t cry over the idea of NOT getting over the hump next year and loading up on another very high pick before the franchise QB takes over (whomever that may be)
Bring Your Game, Leave Your Name.
As for Bradford vs. Clausen
Neither needs to be drafted at the 6 slot, we need a DT or LT before wasting our pick on a QB.
Brian Price (a mid-late 1st round prospect) will likely be the best DT remaining at #6
This is a really bad year to take a offensive tackle with a top 10 pick.
And besides that, QB is the biggest need this team has. Hasselbeck is old, injured, rubber armed, and towards the end, just flat out terrible. The team has no real heir behind him on the roster. Unless McCoy or Suh miraculously fall to #6, I don’t think taking a DT or OT over Bradford/Clausen would be defensible.
Yes it would be
Especially since you need a O-Line to protect a franchise QB or he will become shell shocked by the time you put one together. Plus you can ALWAYS get QB in the 2nd rd. The Hawks most pressing need is OL, DT and Safety/CB. With that being said I would rather the Hawks take a flyer on Berry, Haden, Morgan or A. Davis (OT) with the 6 pick than a QB who would get murdered with our O-Line.
There's a linear rate of decline in QB production after the first one is taken in a draft.
Frankly, the O-line the Seahawks are fielding are not nearly as bad as everyone has made them out to be. Quarterbacks themselves bear a good deal of responsibility for beating pressure, and our QB this year did not do a very good job of that.

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