Open Seahawks Discussion Thread: April 13
I've been a bit bogged down refreshing my CougarLife profile, but my what a busy week we've had! I hate the offseason. I can't shake it. I hate, hate the offseason. No football, that's bad, but I am a sports omnivore and baseball and basketball suffice. It's not the free time either. Alanya is on a crossword kick and doing a crossword with the wife is a kind of cool I can't explain. What bothers me is something else. We are all left waiting outside a black box, interpreting decisions without a great deal of insight into the process. News takes two forms: arrests and deals. I understand I'm in the minority, but I don't think professional athletes owe fans their lives. Want to be asshole? You're hardly alone. I know you're an asshole because you play for my team? That sucks for both of us, I guess.
People are not hopeful either. Sims was good. Tapp was good. Seattle has not roped in a quality free agent. It moved down in the draft to acquire Charlie Whitehurst. I think I understand the plan, but it is a bit disheartening to even temporarily get older and worse when the team was already aged and bad. If this class fails, Seattle is in quite a fix.
This is an open thread. Want to discuss the Seahawks, I'm around. Let's discuss.
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Here's another non-sequitur: schedule should be coming out soon.
I am football geeky enough that I’ve made a quick Seahawks schedule prediction, each year, about this time, just to see how close I can get. It’s never close.
What is everyone doing for draft nights?
I thought about registering for one of the Hawk-hosted draft parties in Bellevue,
http://blog.thenewstribune.com/seahawks/2010/04/12/hawks-to-host-draft-party-events-for-fans/
but I dunno that I want all the noise. Groupthink and groupreaction will probably be rampant, I think I may just stay late at work with some guys, drink some beer, and maybe Twibe it or something.
Hey John,
How do you think Mike Williams would fit in our system? Would he be someone we should consider trading into the third round for?
What little I know of Williams, and I don't know much
He fits, and is very talented, but needs a lot of structure. I can’t say much more than that.
As worried as I am about the new regime, I think Carroll could be really good for those type of players.
Yeah, maybe.
Or at least know how to keep the boat afloat. It’s very different controlling college kids and controlling millionaire children.
Mike Williams the WR formerly from Syracuse?
Forget him. Immature without the talent to back it up. He has some talent, but not enough to match his oversized ego. Its not just because I’m a bitter Syracuse fan either. I hope we stay away.
The USC bust is the one we're looking at.
UFC is to Larry Fitzgerald as Strikeforce is to Plaxico Burress. One is the most dominant in their league, while the other shoots itself in the midst of progress.
Yes, but we don't want anyone to THINK we'd take him.
Jaws and Chucky have now raved about Clausen, and think he’ll be a great pro. PC can’t be blind to that. But they definitely should not be sending out any signals or clues that they like him, or someone will jump us to get him in the draft.
Who would you pick at 6 between
Eric Berry, Trent Williams, and Bryan Bulaga, assuming all are still available?
Much as I love Berry, and so it's close
Left tackle is lower downside, will provide years of service and is a four-alarm need for Seattle.
I wouldn't be upset if we took Berry.
As long as we went offense with the next couple picks.
It's a Casio on a plastic beach
by Roy Weaver Stuckey on Apr 13, 2010 6:21 PM PDT up reply actions
I want Berry cause he's Berry good but I think Bulaga will be there and we'll take him
KC is gonna take Berry.
Somebody tell me about Trent Williams.
by Great Sergios Ghost on Apr 13, 2010 6:33 PM PDT up reply actions
Williams is athletic, smart, skilled and a fast learner
He is not, however, yet, a incredible left tackle.
I don't know if any 1st round tackles really sound like a Gibbs pick
Gibbs seems like a guy who can do a lot with very little, as long as the very little is exactly what he wants.
It's a Casio on a plastic beach
by Roy Weaver Stuckey on Apr 13, 2010 6:44 PM PDT up reply actions
He traded up to get Duane Brown when he was in Houston
I did a little research and I think it was because he had to. I keep hearing about later round picks who would be Gibbs guys: Jared Veldheer from Hillsdale – not a lot is known about him but he is a freak athlete and Ed Wang who has similar skills and size, and Tony Washington who is a sex offender and fucked his sister – but is also a freak athlete too.
At least we aren't the Raiders?
by Generzal Zod on Apr 13, 2010 6:48 PM PDT up reply actions
The sex offender thing is from Walter Football
At least we aren't the Raiders?
by Generzal Zod on Apr 13, 2010 6:49 PM PDT up reply actions
Will he have to register as a sex offender in whatever state he gets drafted by?
It's a Casio on a plastic beach
by Roy Weaver Stuckey on Apr 13, 2010 6:58 PM PDT up reply actions
They made it sound like it kept him out of BCS colleges and that is how he ended up at Abeline Christian
I mean a sister fucker?
At least we aren't the Raiders?
by Generzal Zod on Apr 13, 2010 6:59 PM PDT up reply actions
Yeah
I hope we stay away from that. I’m sure he has grown and isn’t like that anymore but that is just too crazy for me.
It's a Casio on a plastic beach
by Roy Weaver Stuckey on Apr 13, 2010 7:06 PM PDT up reply actions
Creepy and Crazy
I would hate to have him go Barrett Robbins on us.
At least we aren't the Raiders?
by Generzal Zod on Apr 13, 2010 7:07 PM PDT up reply actions
I will never judge a man based on his actions as a teenager
Especially when the media is likely not telling the whole story.
Thank you.
The people in his life since then seem to be believers in him.
inside of a dog it's too dark to read.
Within reason though
He made his name with a HOF left tackle and pushed hard for Houston to make a controversial pick. Once upon a time athletic left tackle was something you could find, but the Gibbs prototype has become the NFL prototype.
Wait a tick....didn't Bulage play in a ZBS at Iowa?
And Trent only played one season at LT for the Sooners….he may be the better prospect, but wouldn’t Bulaga be a better bet to contribute right away? Perhaps I’m missing something here.
That he has more ZBS experience doesn't make him a better ZBS prospct.
Although, he did quite well in it. Gibbs might like being the potter, and Bulaga is already finished ware. The arms, the size, makes him more of a fringe ZBS fit to begin with. He feels like a guy Gibbs wouldn’t be high on, to me, as well.
by jacobstevens on Apr 14, 2010 10:36 AM PDT up reply actions
but have you seen Williams and Bulaga play?
Trent Williams is cat-quick with great feet. He looks every bit like a LT for a quick attacking offense. Bulaga is big and strong and looks like a RT to me. Williams only played at LT for one year, so he is still learning the position. That said, he looked pretty darn good in his first year at the position.
my preferences for pick #6:
- trade down if possible
- Trent Williams or Russel Okung, whomever is available.
- Eric Berry if both those OTs are gone.
"Football players are temperamental. That's 90 percent temper and 10 percent mental." - Doug Plank
Yeah, Gil Brandt says BB would be a very good RT...
and could play LT. Not a great endorsement. He also struggles against both power rushers and speed rushers like OLBs.
If we get him it would be a reach but I hope Gibbs can make him one
At least we aren't the Raiders?
by Generzal Zod on Apr 13, 2010 6:43 PM PDT up reply actions
Williams that is
At least we aren't the Raiders?
by Generzal Zod on Apr 13, 2010 6:43 PM PDT up reply actions
If they took him at 6 I'd be okay with that.
At least we aren't the Raiders?
by Generzal Zod on Apr 13, 2010 6:55 PM PDT up reply actions
Ok
Do you think he would fit well in Gibbs system? Also, I am assuming you think it would be better to get someone like Williams in the first round, than someone like Tony Washington in the 4th or something.
So many teams use safety as, classically, a safety
They stick back and keep the play in front of them, and so they don’t factor a ton, and when they do, a lot of what they do is just have the discipline to not be beat. Berry would be an asset for sure, Seattle could stick another player back there and not have its season undone.
Tackle is not like that. It’s every play and the stakes are huge. I think Williams would fit, and could be exceptional.
Cool.
As far as later round prospects for Safety who could you see Seattle targeting and who can actually play?
Chad Jones? Nate Allen? Kam Chancellor?
by Blake Jensen on Apr 13, 2010 5:07 PM PDT up reply actions
That is the big question.
What does Carroll want? What is the plan for the Seahawks defense? Since I don’t know this stuff, I assume the draft will provide some tangible evidence.
Very True
Seems like he would try to get someone in the mold of Taylor Mays, if not Taylor Mays himself.
by Blake Jensen on Apr 13, 2010 5:37 PM PDT up reply actions
If the Rams take Bradford....
and the Browns or Bills or Raiders pick up Clausen or McCoy. I feel that the next franchise quarterback for the Seahawks will virtually fall into their lap in next year’s draft. Most of the bad teams would then have their quarterbacks of the future, and providing the Seahawks have a 5-7 win season, could have their choice of Locker, Luck, Mallet, or Pryor.
Well
There is a under the radar prospect in this draft that is from, while not our, at least our neighbors back yard. Kiper has him as his #5 QB in the draft – Eastern Washington University QB Matt Nichols
From WalterFootball
Height: 6-2. Weight: 219.
Projected 40 Time: 4.78.
Pro Day 40 Time: 4.88.
Hand: .
Projected Round (2010): FA.
7/24/08: Matt Nichols put up prolific numbers at Division 1-AA Eastern Washington as a sophomore (3,744 yards, 34 TDs, 9 INTs), but he didn’t play any BCS competition, so we don’t really know what he’s made of just yet.
Walter has him undrafted. I think he might have chops if we don’t really dig on Teel anymore.
2/3 of the world is covered by water. The rest is covered by Marcus Trufant.
The next John Kitna... except from EWU not CWU
It's a Casio on a plastic beach
by Roy Weaver Stuckey on Apr 13, 2010 6:15 PM PDT up reply actions
There's still Denver.
Carolina. Tennessee, if things don’t work out this year. One of the remaining of who you mentioned, figure to still be in need. Between Washington and Philly, one of them is bound to have a QB question for next year.
And we could win 7 games and sit at 17 and no have any chance at the good ones. Who knows. I see your point, though.
by jacobstevens on Apr 14, 2010 10:47 AM PDT up reply actions
Are the Seahawks still actively pursuing Brandon Marshall?
John Clayton said he could be moved within the next 24 hours.
If Taylor Swift were to try and tackle me, I'd let her.
PS3 ID: broncomaniac6
Just a fun question, but on a scale of 1-10, how pumped is everyone for the draft?
Because despite a less than satisfying off-season so far, I’m super pumped.
I am excited for it to be over and to have some real Seahawks to scout
and not just pick names from the fog.
I was pumped for last year's draft because I was hoping
Our draft would help the Seahawks have a slight-to-big rebound in 2009. That didn’t happen. The draft class did okay in 2009 but the veterans like Hasselbeck were just miserable.
Now with such a miserable offseason I only think management will blow the draft too.
UFC is to Larry Fitzgerald as Strikeforce is to Plaxico Burress. One is the most dominant in their league, while the other shoots itself in the midst of progress.
John's last few posts have me really excited about this draft.
This is our biggest draft since ‘97 and I’m super pumped about 6 and 14, and with Carroll and Schneider putting a lot of chips into this draft it’s gonna be really fun to see what they do trade wise during the draft and who they’ll take.
We're excited like non-stop!
Though they sink through the Sea, they shall rise again...Death shall have no dominion...
I'm super nervous...
Its like a playoff game where you are one and done. You either advance to fight another day or you are mired in mediocrity for a number of years to come.
I'm excited.
Being a California Seahawks fan means I need to go looking for coverage. When the team has two first rounders, the broadcasters will be forced to focus on them for a little bit.
This draft has really worn on me for some reason, I'm super excited to have it done already.
Also, getting drunk and pining for Everette Brown to slip to us in the second round and ACTUALLY HAVING IT HAPPEN last year was too much fun so I have high hopes of a similar repeat.
Yeah, I'll probably be let down next week, so I figured I'd just enjoy the chance to be somewhat optimistic now.
John did a pretty good job of talking me off the cliff with Mays so I have a hard time seeing how I could come away from the draft too disappointed.
It’s such a good year that even dumb picks should have some decent upside.
I'm an 8
because we can’t possibly lose any more players that I really like.
by Hancock.Brett on Apr 13, 2010 5:21 PM PDT up reply actions
Yeah, I think it's just 6 and 14 that have me really excited.
I figure it’s gonna be tough to mess up those two picks, even if they took Dez Bryant and Taylor Mays your still getting two fantastic talents. Not that I want those two guys, but there would be reasons to be excited about them.
I'm very excited
And like John, I just want it to be over.
There is so much freaking uncertainty right now, it’s really painful. What kind of defense are we going to run? What kind of offense? Who’s starting QB? How’s our line going to look when it’s ‘done’? Is Forsett our new starter?
So many questions, so few answers.
6/14/60. Sweet.
I'm excited
but my nervousness really exceeds that. I think, without really concluding it on purpose per se, I see the outcome of the draft as really boom or bust. Probably because i’ve gotten so attached to certain players at certain picks and certain scenarios from all this ridiculous reading about football.
Though they sink through the Sea, they shall rise again...Death shall have no dominion...
What are the chances Jennings gets cut or even traded?
I say fairly high.
UFC is to Larry Fitzgerald as Strikeforce is to Plaxico Burress. One is the most dominant in their league, while the other shoots itself in the midst of progress.
He has little trade value and does not cost much
If he is cut, I think it will happen prior to the regular season.
I'd think we won't cut him unless someone better shows him up in camp/preseason.
Sounds obvious, but there seem to be a lot of people around who just want him gone ASAP.
This.
I know no one wants him starting, but he’s not bad as cheap depth until we get someone with more potential to replace him.
He's a first down waiting to happen and not in a good way.
Bambi needs to go!
by Trojan Knight on Apr 13, 2010 5:50 PM PDT up reply actions
Jennings is not bad
He is one of the 3 fastest Hawks, has a 40’ vertical, and is a good man CB who was used improperly. He is an ideal Man CB for a normal sized WR. NO CB in the NFL will look good when you decide to send 3 or 4 pass rushers vs 6 blockers all the time giving the QB 10 seconds to throw…..
40 foot vertical huh?
It's a Casio on a plastic beach
by Roy Weaver Stuckey on Apr 14, 2010 10:56 PM PDT up reply actions
Yeah, it's why he's been struggling so much in this league
QB’s tend to throw underneath his gigantic leaps around the field.
by MT Olson on Apr 15, 2010 1:37 AM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Why do you think we didn't re-sign Milloy?
2/3 of the world is covered by water. The rest is covered by Marcus Trufant.
I think Seattle needs to seriously look at getting someone who can be a great special teams returner
Forsett is awful and so is Rankin. If it isn’t Spiller (killing two birds with one stone) then who would you look for?
UFC is to Larry Fitzgerald as Strikeforce is to Plaxico Burress. One is the most dominant in their league, while the other shoots itself in the midst of progress.
There should be dozens, honestly. It's not an uncommon skill set.
As I’ve said before, Seattle’s return situation was moronic.
It would be a big enough upgrade to have ONE of our returners know how to properly fair catch.
UFC is to Larry Fitzgerald as Strikeforce is to Plaxico Burress. One is the most dominant in their league, while the other shoots itself in the midst of progress.
Reggie Williams...
he could lay some blocks.
by jacobstevens on Apr 14, 2010 10:48 AM PDT up reply actions
I love the Cougarlife nod...
…funny stuff.
I’d like to see the team retain two first rounders. I could probably deal with the loss of one first rounder if it resulted in multiple second rounders, because of the number of needs our team has.
I keep wondering if we’ll forgo a left tackle in the first round based on the Gibbs factor. I’m not saying we don’t need one, because we do, and it is probably the biggest need our team has. But I have a feeling that they partly picked Gibbs so they could deal with other positions earlier.
Otherwise, our needs are plentiful and have been well illustrated by Mr. Morgan’s hard work.
Tryouts
Has anyone heard how either Mike Williams or Reggie Williams looked during camp today?
by MICHAEL MCGLYNN on Apr 13, 2010 5:12 PM PDT reply actions
Have you seen any Freddie Barnes?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Aw0a-5xV—w
This is admittedly all I’ve seen but the man had 22 catches in one game. He’s clearly not fast but reports say that he excels at getting separation and clearly has exceptional hands. Housh2.0?
No, I haven't
Pass wacky offense though, so I would not put much stock into his numbers. College numbers just do not translate for wide reciever. Eddie Royal never surpassed 500 yards receiving in a season, because he played in a run heavy offense.
If it came down to these three running backs at one of our picks
who would we pick?
Ben Tate, Montero Hardesty, or Joe McKnight?
I'm leary of McKnight.
He played on some exceptional offenses against middling pac-10 defenses and was never much more than decent.
Too much upside
I wouldn’t mind it as long as he slips a bit
It's a Casio on a plastic beach
by Roy Weaver Stuckey on Apr 13, 2010 6:25 PM PDT up reply actions
Is there really that much upside?
His combine numbers weren’t impressive and his production was just ok.
I dunno. I guess I don't like Clausen because of the Notre Dame hype
I shouldn’t like McKnight because of the U$C hype.
DeShaun Foster would have had a decent career if he wasn’t always injured.
It's a Casio on a plastic beach
by Roy Weaver Stuckey on Apr 13, 2010 6:28 PM PDT up reply actions
That was what John was referring too. McKnight found it difficult to stay healthy
and Pete play him despite better alternatives on the bench.
by Trojan Knight on Apr 13, 2010 6:34 PM PDT up reply actions
That's what I'm nervous about with Pete
I hope he doesn’t play U$C guys over other guys with a little more talent or upside.
It's a Casio on a plastic beach
by Roy Weaver Stuckey on Apr 13, 2010 6:35 PM PDT up reply actions
I hope he knows the difference between the pro game and college game
At least we aren't the Raiders?
by Generzal Zod on Apr 13, 2010 6:44 PM PDT up reply actions
or not pay his players - oh...
At least we aren't the Raiders?
by Generzal Zod on Apr 14, 2010 11:11 AM PDT up reply actions
Not sure what upside there is
If Pete hadn’t been enamored with the idea of finding another Reggie Bush then McKnight would’ve and should’ve lost his starting job multiple times. He’s not reliable at all with the ball, which is why he lost his returner duties, and even when he manages to break past the line of scrimmage he doesn’t seem to have that same burst or whatever to finish off big runs. I’m not a scout or anything, so I can’t tell you specifically what it is that caused that, be it overall top speed or his acceleration but for a guy who was supposedly a top end track runner he got caught a lot.
[DELETED ZOMG NO POLITICS]
He looks pretty awesome.
How much stock do you put in Hardesty’s combine numbers? He was about the only good thing on Tenessee’s offense and then excelled in all of the drills.
Well, I have never bought into Hardesty, honestly, but you're right, he excelled on an ass offense
I see him as someone that be very good for whatever short time he’s not injured, but could lose his ability to injury before he even establishes himself.
So if Tate is there at 60
assuming we haven’t traded it, do we take him?
by Blake Jensen on Apr 13, 2010 5:27 PM PDT up reply actions
Also, what does everyone think about the guy out of Buffalo
James Starks?
by Blake Jensen on Apr 13, 2010 5:32 PM PDT up reply actions
4th round prospect at best, but interesting there.
by SeahawksFanInNY on Apr 13, 2010 5:40 PM PDT up reply actions
rather
I don’t mean to sound like a draft expert or talent scout. That’s just the highest I’ve seen any site grade him.
by SeahawksFanInNY on Apr 13, 2010 5:41 PM PDT up reply actions
Give him the right line, why not?
But I don’t think he is anything particularly special or worth investing in.
Could be a later-round Kevin Smith or Matt Forte type.
Not overly special, but potential NFL starter and can play every down.
Early prospect watch: RB C.J. Spiller, QB Sam Bradford, OT Ciron Black*, DT Gerald McCoy, S Eric Berry, DT Ndamukong Suh, CB Ras-I Dowling**, RB Jonathan Dwyer
Forte has great receiving ability, no doubt.
Early prospect watch: RB C.J. Spiller, QB Sam Bradford, OT Ciron Black*, DT Gerald McCoy, S Eric Berry, DT Ndamukong Suh, CB Ras-I Dowling**, RB Jonathan Dwyer
I dream of Hardesty spinning us to victory.
Dwight Freeney would be jealous.
by jacobstevens on Apr 14, 2010 11:04 AM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Assuming the Seahawks take an OT at 6...
judging from mocks I’ve seen, looks like Derrick Morgan or C.J. Spiller at 14. Any other strong candidates here?
Seahawks-4-Life
Oh, maybe they'll take Clausen.
Then maybe Bruce Campbell. I suspect Bulaga will fall, but probably not that far…
Seahawks-4-Life
I don't think the 49ers will take Clausen
Unless they are not entirely sure Alex Smith will be decent this season.
The Bills would be much more likely.
The Seahawks have traded my signature to the Detroit Lions for a 6th round draft pick.
If Haden is there at 14
should we take him?
by Blake Jensen on Apr 13, 2010 6:03 PM PDT up reply actions
Never know.
Seattle had younger, better Tatupu-Hill-Peterson and drafted a linebacker fourth overall.
True. (Maybe wishful thinking on my part.)
But this may be the reason we still need a tackle as badly as we do.
Seahawks-4-Life
after they got rid of Peterson, of course.
This time, we don’t actually HAVE a choice.
You never know
Hill might be suspended for around 8 games, maybe even be released. If Curry moves to DE we will have a huge hole at OLB.
It's a Casio on a plastic beach
by Roy Weaver Stuckey on Apr 13, 2010 6:18 PM PDT up reply actions
The good news it Carroll knows how to identify good, if not great, linebackers.
by Trojan Knight on Apr 13, 2010 6:35 PM PDT up reply actions
Our new linebackers coach too?
It's a Casio on a plastic beach
by Roy Weaver Stuckey on Apr 13, 2010 6:39 PM PDT up reply actions
Norton Jr. was the only thing I liked about the 90's Cowboys
I saw a lot of him when I was a kid, he could be a head coach one day.
At least we aren't the Raiders?
by Generzal Zod on Apr 13, 2010 6:41 PM PDT up reply actions
Shouldn't be a '?'
It's a Casio on a plastic beach
by Roy Weaver Stuckey on Apr 13, 2010 6:42 PM PDT up reply actions
I'm mixed on Norton
on the one hand River/Rey/Cushing/Matthews became a feared group, on the other hand it felt like they became an undisciplined group who played for big hits and intimidation more so than containment or turnovers.
I should really go back and see if USC turnover numbers were dipping before Coach Norton arrived or not.
[DELETED ZOMG NO POLITICS]
June-July I will do a couple series looking at the Bates offense and the Carroll defense.
It will be a more backloaded offseason than usual.
Looking forward to it.
UFC is to Larry Fitzgerald as Strikeforce is to Plaxico Burress. One is the most dominant in their league, while the other shoots itself in the midst of progress.
I look forward to those
I think Bates could be our biggest addition of the off season.
by Hancock.Brett on Apr 13, 2010 5:37 PM PDT up reply actions
I look forward to them to
So much more interesting to write about substance rather than speculation and hype.
I already asked this, but in case it slipped through the cracks,
can I request a Greg Knapp season retrospective? It might tell us something about the remaining offensive pieces.
by jacobstevens on Apr 14, 2010 11:06 AM PDT up reply actions
I'm still somewhat hoping that we work out my fantasy trade where we trade something (not Housh anymore)
In order to get Tashard Choice. I’m a huge Tashard Choice fan. If we can’t get Spiller and don’t want to go to the draft, I would like a Choice/Forsett/Ganther trio.
UFC is to Larry Fitzgerald as Strikeforce is to Plaxico Burress. One is the most dominant in their league, while the other shoots itself in the midst of progress.
I'd totally do a Housh for Choice trade...especially if we get Marshall.
But does Dallas need more WR’s?
They have no need to keep Roy Williams so I guess that's a subtraction for them as
A body count at WR.
UFC is to Larry Fitzgerald as Strikeforce is to Plaxico Burress. One is the most dominant in their league, while the other shoots itself in the midst of progress.
We can find our own Tashard Choice in the mid to late rounds.
We won’t find a WR like Housh there. That move I think would be horrible. Choice isn’t really that special. Plays in a great offense, runs behind a good O-line, and the team often is protecting leads. I like Choice, but why not just draft a similar pair that’s younger and has fresher legs without opening another hole on offense?
Early prospect watch: RB C.J. Spiller, QB Sam Bradford, OT Ciron Black*, DT Gerald McCoy, S Eric Berry, DT Ndamukong Suh, CB Ras-I Dowling**, RB Jonathan Dwyer
If we get Marshall I don't think trading Housh really opens another hole.
We could get a Choice like back in the mid rounds, but this team has bigger needs a guard, safety, tackle and maybe defensive end. I think it makes more sense to make a trade for a player like Choice than to draft one.
How's your book coming along?
Beat John Morgan and Scruffy’s ass in Fantasy Football
by tohereknowswhen on Apr 13, 2010 5:57 PM PDT reply actions
Funny you mention that.
The deadline was March 15 and I have submitted the manuscript. I haven’t heard much from my editors, and so I’ve been a little tight lipped. Truth is, I had no idea what I was doing for a while and am still very much a babe in the woods about the process, my own and the publisher’s. I could go on, but I would only embarrass myself.
I’ll let you what I know when I know more. This fall.
The only tangible impact of the book thus far, well, aside from the advance, is that I am, for the first time in my life, a little writing fatigued. Which is part of why I am moving content towards later in the offseason. Right now, just opening up the laptop can be a little daunting.
Congratulations on finishing the manuscript.
I don’t think silence on the other end suggests a negative reception. Your FG posts are closely edited, written with flair, and, most importantly, they feature a clear logic. As long as your manuscript possesses the same qualities, you’ll be fine.
Can’t wait for the public readings.
Beat John Morgan and Scruffy’s ass in Fantasy Football
by tohereknowswhen on Apr 13, 2010 6:22 PM PDT up reply actions
I hope you get to plug the book here.
At least we aren't the Raiders?
by Generzal Zod on Apr 13, 2010 6:53 PM PDT up reply actions
With Kerney retiring, but us getting a couple DEs via trade and one visiting...
What are the chances Curry actually makes the move to DE?
It's a Casio on a plastic beach
by Roy Weaver Stuckey on Apr 13, 2010 6:13 PM PDT reply actions
I would still say high.
I think Carroll looks at it as putting the best talent at the most important position.
I hope he does make that move.
I would love to see him start practicing there asap.
It's a Casio on a plastic beach
by Roy Weaver Stuckey on Apr 13, 2010 6:19 PM PDT up reply actions
Curry kicks dick as a stand-up DE in Madden.
Jussayin’.
by DJ C-Raig on Apr 13, 2010 6:21 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Its just one of the wonkinesses of how Madden generates
overall ratings. For some reason the things that give a player a high rating at DE are weighted differently than for a OLB. A low 80s OLB is almost always a high 80s to low 90s DE in the game.
[DELETED ZOMG NO POLITICS]
This begs a question that I've been wanting to get feedback on.
Here is a list of positions ordered according to one person’s perception of postional value. How differently do you view it? (I kind of remember you knocking LT down a peg or two, but it’s still would remain fairly high on the list IIRC). It’s still hard for me to fathom drafting a Safety, as great as Berry may be, in the top-6. I’m wondering what you think about so-called ‘positional value’?
Quarterback
Offensive Tackle
Defensive End/ Rush Linebacker
Running Back
Wide Receiver
Cornerback
Nose Tackle (3-4 only)
Defensive Tackle/3-4 Defensive End
Middle Linebacker
Offensive Guard
Outside Linebacker
Tight End
Center
Safety
Kick Returner
Punt Returner
Fullback
Punter
Kicker
Special Teams
Early prospect watch: RB C.J. Spiller, QB Sam Bradford, OT Ciron Black*, DT Gerald McCoy, S Eric Berry, DT Ndamukong Suh, CB Ras-I Dowling**, RB Jonathan Dwyer
Is it about positional importance?
Or also about how easy it is to find talent for the position.
Also, it’s too easy to stare oneself blind on positional rankings. It’s not like McCoy/Suh would be bad top-3 picks because their position is ranked 8th.
by Thomas Beekers on Apr 13, 2010 6:32 PM PDT up reply actions
Personally I'd knock running back down around middle linebacker,
just because it’s the position on the offense that’s easiest to fill with an able body that can do a decent job. Can’t say that about O-line, QB, WR.
I'd imagine 4-3 DT is much higher than that.
And defensive end is lower. Teams typically don’t get much pressure via DEs with mediocre/bad interior linemen.
6/14/60. Sweet.
Step 1:Carrol digs
around in last years playbook and finds the hidden gem of all football wisdom-THE TWO KICKER PLAY.
Step 2: #6 overall – whoever the best kicker is.
Step 3:Tender Mare and him a 10 year deal conditional on each other.
Step 4:???
Step 5: Touchdown (and lots of profit.)
2/3 of the world is covered by water. The rest is covered by Marcus Trufant.
by Chickadee on Apr 13, 2010 10:01 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
If you were a QB going for 2
And you had no one open, so you just threw the ball through the goal posts, would you essentially be throwing it away? If you drop-kicked it through would that count as an XP?
The way I see it
Every position is going to get filled, so by “positional value” we really mean “the value of ability at that position.”
At some positions, there’s a lot of value in having a league-average player but not much added value in having an elite player; other positions are the opposite.
Wide Receivers and Defensive Ends are playmakers; the better the talent, the more plays they make. Their counterparts— defensive backs & offensive tackles— are more like play-stoppers. You want a minimum level of ability, but you get diminishing returns at the elite level because either (a)they clearly have their counterpart overmatched, or (b)another play-stopper at that position is giving up the pass/sack anyway.
Some play-stoppers, like Defensive Tackles and pass-eligible blockers (Tight Ends & Fullbacks) can also be playmakers, but need to be at an elite level to really make a big difference.
multi-colored geekness warning

So, just rattling off the top of my head, I would assign positional value within each category thusly:
LINEAR
Quarterback
Middle Linebacker
Outside Linebacker
Running Back
Kick Returner
Punter
Kicker
DIMINISHING RETURNS
Offensive Tackle
Cornerback
Nose Tackle (3-4)
Guard
Center
Gunner
HIGH UPSIDE
Defensive End (4-3)
Wide Receiver
Rush Linebacker (3-4)
ELITE UPSIDE
Defensive Tackle (4-3)
Defenisve End (3-4)
Safety
Tight End
Fullback
Punt Returner
I’d start with your list, then consider the talent level available/needed at the position. Teams don’t want to spend a high draft pick on an offensive tackle, but they really want to avoid falling off the cliff into the significantly-below-average range (which is why I think all starting tackles are paid pretty well, unlike low-end starters at Wide Receiver who make only a fraction of what the elite wideouts get). The likes of Polamalu and (we suspect) Suh crack the “elite” level as high-upside playmakers, giving them significant marginal value over an “above average” player at their positions.
by Jason_D on Apr 14, 2010 11:43 AM PDT up reply actions 3 recs
I like it.
Note: the list I posted wasn’t ‘my list’ but a list I found on the web. I wanted to use it as a base example and discussion piece. I don’t agree with all of the order on the list I posted, but some of it makes sense.
I especially like what you said here:
At some positions, there’s a lot of value in having a league-average player but not much added value in having an elite player; other positions are the opposite
and I think that probably speaks to the argument for drafting Berry, though I’m ambivalent about that.
Early prospect watch: RB C.J. Spiller, QB Sam Bradford, OT Ciron Black*, DT Gerald McCoy, S Eric Berry, DT Ndamukong Suh, CB Ras-I Dowling**, RB Jonathan Dwyer
Tackles don't make a difference?
I went through pro bowl selections for offensive linemen for the last 10-15 years and pulled out the most consistent, long-term players.
The list includes tackles Walter Jones, Jonathan Ogden, Orlando Pace, Alan Faneca, center Kevin Mawae, and guards Steve Hutchinson and Will Shields.
The tackles have some things in common. 3-5 years after draft/acquisition, they were playing for superbowl contenders (Seattle, Baltimore, Pittsburgh, St Louis) and they were all taken in the first round.
When a team has both a pro bowl tackle and guard at the same time (Redskins in the ’80s, St Louis in the 90s/00s, etc.) it has the potential to dominate for years. At the very least, when a team like KC has a couple of great linemen, it has a very good running game. Think about the teams that Lincoln Kennedy, Larry Allen and Willie Roaf played for.
The idea that we’re going to get our magic line coach to turn late-round linemen into the kind we need for running backs and receivers to be ‘play makers’ is not consistent with any evidence I’ve seen of what makes a dominant team. ‘League average’ talent just doesn’t get the job done on the line.
by BurtonOerney on Apr 14, 2010 2:58 PM PDT up reply actions
OTs drafted no later than 1.06 the past 20 years:
Rk Year Rnd Pick ? Pos Tm
1 1997 1 1 Orlando Pace T STL
2 2008 1 1 Jake Long T MIA
3 2009 1 2 Jason Smith T STL
4 2001 1 2 Leonard Davis T ARI
5 2004 1 2 Robert Gallery T OAK
6 1995 1 2 Tony Boselli T JAX
7 1989 1 2 Tony Mandarich T GNB
8 2000 1 3 Chris Samuels T WAS
9 2007 1 3 Joe Thomas T CLE
10 1996 1 4 Jonathan Ogden T BAL
11 2002 1 4 Mike D. Williams T BUF
12 2006 1 4 D’Brickashaw Ferguson T NYJ
13 2007 1 5 Levi Brown T ARI
14 1997 1 6 Walter Jones T SEA
15 2009 1 6 Smith Andre T CIN
link and rest of first-round here.
Early prospect watch: RB C.J. Spiller, QB Sam Bradford, OT Ciron Black*, DT Gerald McCoy, S Eric Berry, DT Ndamukong Suh, CB Ras-I Dowling**, RB Jonathan Dwyer
Now again with only the viable Left Tackles:
Rk Year Rnd Pick ? Pos Tm
1 1997 1 1 Orlando Pace T STL
2 2008 1 1 Jake Long T MIA
3 2009 1 2 Jason Smith T STL
4 2001 1 2 Leonard Davis T ARI
5 2004 1 2 Robert Gallery T OAK
6 1995 1 2 Tony Boselli T JAX
7 1989 1 2 Tony Mandarich T GNB
8 2000 1 3 Chris Samuels T WAS
9 2007 1 3 Joe Thomas T CLE
10 1996 1 4 Jonathan Ogden T BAL
11 2002 1 4 Mike D. Williams T BUF
12 2006 1 4 D’Brickashaw Ferguson T NYJ
13 2007 1 5 Levi Brown T ARI
14 1997 1 6 Walter Jones T SEA
15 2009 1 6 Smith Andre T CIN
That’s approx. 10 true Left Tackles drafted in the top-6 picks over the past 20 drafts. Is the 2nd or 3rd best LT in this draft going to be worthy of that high of a pick?
I understand that most highly picked LT prospects have longevity and generally are a good investment. But, as far as it being a difference-making position, I think that perception has changed over the years. Teams are so creative with blitzing and the proliferation of 3-4 defenses, the LT isn’t the one be-all-end-all must-have position it used to be. It’s very important, but it’s more of a “not much added value in having an elite player” type of pick.
Early prospect watch: RB C.J. Spiller, QB Sam Bradford, OT Ciron Black*, DT Gerald McCoy, S Eric Berry, DT Ndamukong Suh, CB Ras-I Dowling**, RB Jonathan Dwyer
Surrounding talent matters too, of course
I think that probably speaks to the argument for drafting Berry, though I’m ambivalent about that.
Likewise. I think there’s a lot to be said for having an elite safety; Brian Burke from Advanced NFL Stats wrote an analysis of Polamalu’s contribution to the Steelers that was very compelling.
When a team has both a pro bowl tackle and guard at the same time (Redskins in the ’80s, St Louis in the 90s/00s, etc.) it has the potential to dominate for years.
Good point. Honestly, I’m not a football/personnel/scouting expert by any stretch, I’m just decent at conceptual praxeology and drawing curves.
So maybe tackles and guards should be classified as “Linear” or “Elite Upside” with the caveat that his neighbor on the line has comparable ability.
Cheers,
Jason
both a pro bowl tackle and guard?
sounds like Hutch and Jones to me.
2/3 of the world is covered by water. The rest is covered by Marcus Trufant.
Regarding this great tackle/guard combo thing and its impact
the amalgamation of talent tends to make the talent better. Shaun, Matt, Walt and Hutch were all better because of each other. None of it was unidirectional in correlation.
It’s a very real thing, the impact, but it’s a different matter entirely from what you originally posted, and if there is a curve to subjectively plot its impact, it would surely be something different. Possibly another high upside, exponential type of curve.
by jacobstevens on Apr 15, 2010 1:24 PM PDT up reply actions
I think it's true, though
and it’s not reflective of the value of OT at all. I find it similar to fielding ability in baseball. It’s quite valuable. Some guys are not among the elite at their position in defensive abilities, but their fielding % is still 99.something. And no one is 100%.
Walt was not credited with a sack in 2004. But he wasn’t perfect. And sacks happen. He had a tremendous 2005, and even had a pretty good game against the Giants even though Umenyiora got 2 sacks directly off him 1-on-1.
At some point, your offense is as enabled by your OT as it’s going to be. It then becomes a matter of consistency and maintaining that enabling against elite competition. Walter Jones is historically elite, while Chris Samuels was generationally elite. He was not as good as Walt, Ogden, or Pace. But the impact of Samuels not being Pace/Jones good, was rather negligible
At least for OT, the curve probably ought to be much steeper at the bottom, then curve higher, and then flatten out at the top, about as it is, or maybe a little flatter. it’s not flat on the top because great tackles aren’t immensely valueable; it’s flatter on the top because at some point you’ve got yourself a Flozell Adams, Bryant McKinnie, a guy who can’t hold a fucking candle to Walter Jones but who has enabled your offense to still close to maximum extent.
by jacobstevens on Apr 15, 2010 1:21 PM PDT up reply actions
So this is full of awesome.
But I don’t think a QBs value is linear. As your QB’s ability rises above that of the competition, it’s more exponential. Like the high upside curve, but with an even steeper trajectory at the top. QB is the playmaker among playmakers, so I’d put the position in your high upside group.
The “elite upside” title was a bit confusing to me. I figured it out, but at first glance I thought you meant almost the opposite of your description.
by jacobstevens on Apr 15, 2010 1:13 PM PDT up reply actions
Are people more nervous or excited for the draft?
I know the moves that have happened so far haven’t really given people a reason to be excited. Evaluating young talent is what this front office should be good at so I am still excited for the draft.
It's a Casio on a plastic beach
by Roy Weaver Stuckey on Apr 13, 2010 6:24 PM PDT reply actions
Anxious.
I expect a lot is going to happen and some of it I will have mixed feelings about. We will have a different team come Monday.
by John Morgan on Apr 13, 2010 6:29 PM PDT up reply actions 2 recs
I'm rec'ing this
Because it echoes my sentiments almost exactly. It’s that feeling you get when you hold the letter from Med School, or Grad School in your hands and you haven’t opened it yet.
I'm excited for it!
There are more options that would it a good draft than ways of screwing it up. As long as they don’t do anything stupid the first three picks are going to make our team a lot better.
At least we aren't the Raiders?
by Generzal Zod on Apr 13, 2010 6:36 PM PDT up reply actions
Just defended my Master's research project today
It's a Casio on a plastic beach
by Roy Weaver Stuckey on Apr 13, 2010 6:36 PM PDT up reply actions
I'm doing mine in the fall so honestly if the team sucks I may not notice like I would in other years.
I’ll watch the games but may be working while I do it.
At least we aren't the Raiders?
by Generzal Zod on Apr 13, 2010 6:38 PM PDT up reply actions
good luck in the fall
It's a Casio on a plastic beach
by Roy Weaver Stuckey on Apr 13, 2010 6:41 PM PDT up reply actions
and I hope yours went well
what subject area and topic?
At least we aren't the Raiders?
by Generzal Zod on Apr 13, 2010 6:38 PM PDT up reply actions
It was called...
DOES IT PAY TO BE GOOD AT DEFENSE? EVIDENCE FROM MAJOR LEAGUE BASEBALL
Sports economics research paper basically about UZR being negatively correlated to salary
It's a Casio on a plastic beach
by Roy Weaver Stuckey on Apr 13, 2010 6:41 PM PDT up reply actions
Fuckin' A mine is in education - connection between literacy and writing
They’re not so difficult, do the qualitative research in your own class, then report
At least we aren't the Raiders?
by Generzal Zod on Apr 13, 2010 6:51 PM PDT up reply actions
Yeah my major is applied economics
So i figured if I had to do a 30+ page paper, I might as well do something I am interested in. I still have a 15+ page pager due though on social cohesion and performance in baseball for a sports management class I am in. I really suck at qualitative stuff so it’ll be interesting.
It's a Casio on a plastic beach
by Roy Weaver Stuckey on Apr 13, 2010 6:54 PM PDT up reply actions
Per Yahoo: [Seahawks] "have had internal discussions about acquiring [Marshawn] Lynch."
http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news?slug=cr-marshawnoffers041310
Buffalo is hoping to get a second round pick for him. I hope we hurry up and trade for Marshall and put an end to this “internal discussion” about Lynch. Unlike Marshall, I don’t think Lynch is talent enough to deal with his antics.
The article claims Lynch and Forsett are best friends. I did not know that.
I think it's reasonable to have discussions
I just hope that those discussions are about trying to get him for a fifth or maybe a fourth. Living in Rochester, I’ve seen a ton of the guy. Last season wasn’t his best, but prior to that, you saw a great motor with great power who could really move the pile.
by SeahawksFanInNY on Apr 13, 2010 6:32 PM PDT up reply actions
and he looks like the Geico Caveman
and talks like one too. I don’t know if I would love him on the field but I will listen to every interview he gives.
At least we aren't the Raiders?
by Generzal Zod on Apr 13, 2010 6:34 PM PDT up reply actions
Here is our 5th-rounder. Thank you very much.
Lynch: Seattle RB1.
Early prospect watch: RB C.J. Spiller, QB Sam Bradford, OT Ciron Black*, DT Gerald McCoy, S Eric Berry, DT Ndamukong Suh, CB Ras-I Dowling**, RB Jonathan Dwyer
Cal-Cal, 1-2 punch
I don’t really like Lynch. I have never liked him. I hope they stay away from him.
It's a Casio on a plastic beach
by Roy Weaver Stuckey on Apr 13, 2010 6:34 PM PDT up reply actions
I think Lynch has less antics than Marshall.
He is kind of a whiner but most of it can be written off as “stupid is as stupid does.”
At least we aren't the Raiders?
by Generzal Zod on Apr 13, 2010 6:40 PM PDT up reply actions
Involved in a shady hit and run incident that he somehow avoided punishment for
and then he got suspended for gun charges.He’s definitely a risky guy to trade for. One more f-up and he’d probably face a really long suspension.
That said, I’m sure I could talk myself into acquiring him if and when he trade our second round pick for Marshall. At least then we’d give up no more than a 4th rounder(s) for him.
fuck him then
I don’t want to have to explain that kind of shit to my students when they ask why I love the Seahawks.
At least we aren't the Raiders?
by Generzal Zod on Apr 13, 2010 6:58 PM PDT up reply actions
He's a good back, no doubt.
I think he’s better than Fred Jackson, no matter how either performed in 2009. In another year, different draft class, I think he would be a great buy-low pickup. Young, cheap, talented, scheme correct, healthy, likely to benefit from coaching, but this is a good class. Good class for backs, great class all around for talent. Seattle could offer a 2011 pick, maybe.
Here's a thought, that might not even be worth 2 cents
Deion Branch (plus something, like a low pick) for Lynch. Branch is a little older and injury-prone, but Lynch’s personal issues balance that out a little. Marshawn is still better than Branch, hence the extra something.
Certainly something to consider, especially if we get Marshall and use our other draft picks for other positions.
I'd rather have two guys that hate (well, dislike) each other competing for carries.
by Trojan Knight on Apr 13, 2010 6:41 PM PDT up reply actions
My next research paper
Social cohesion and it’s affect on performance
It's a Casio on a plastic beach
by Roy Weaver Stuckey on Apr 13, 2010 6:47 PM PDT up reply actions
That would be some thunder and lightning tandem.
2/3 of the world is covered by water. The rest is covered by Marcus Trufant.
Jim Mora is going to be an analyst for the draft on the NFL Network.
Analyzing the dirtbags in this class.
The Seahawks have traded my signature to the Detroit Lions for a 6th round draft pick.
He can't stand the mention of ours
At least we aren't the Raiders?
by Generzal Zod on Apr 13, 2010 6:51 PM PDT up reply actions
Ever since he was fired I can't get enough of him.
The Seahawks have traded my signature to the Detroit Lions for a 6th round draft pick.
Not me. It feels like he did us wrong, and we did him wrong, and the whole thing should just be discarded into the past.
Everything he said is bullcrap and immateurish
That’s why I love him. He is so full of himself and it’s hilarious to watch.
The Seahawks have traded my signature to the Detroit Lions for a 6th round draft pick.
He's an entitled, childish jerk with no sense of reality.
Calling out the FO when he didn’t plan for a back up long snapper and had to have try outs during a game, blaming the PR staff when he said dumb stuff, throwing Spencer under the bus because his defense sucked, leaking private text messages. Everything that comes out of his mouth is trash.
There's almost no reason to give Mora another job in the NFL coaching wise.
The Seahawks have traded my signature to the Detroit Lions for a 6th round draft pick.
Then there was the interview with Kevin Calabro on KJR that might have been the most awkward on-air interview ever.
The entire time I was listening I was saying to myself “Oh…You’re not really going to go there are you? Oh good lord. You did.”
How did we do him wrong?
He sucked as a coach. I went to that Bucs game last year that fucker owes me $100.
At least we aren't the Raiders?
by Generzal Zod on Apr 13, 2010 7:01 PM PDT up reply actions
Put into a pretty hopeless predicament.
I’d like to think he was fired because he seems to be a terrible coach, but the team tanked and he took the fall.
I can't imagine why the team didn't give him their all.
by Nate Dogg on Apr 13, 2010 7:11 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
I'm seriously.
I, of course, didn’t even consider firing Mora as an option after last season because he should have had at least one year to fix the mistakes he made. But thinking about the whole dirtbags thing and the subsequent changes he made moving guys into different positions… I’m good with the firing. He really seemed like a good fit before the season though. I’m trying to remember how I felt about him so I can compare how I feel about Carroll. I liked seeing the little clips of Carroll in minicamp.
by BurtonOerney on Apr 14, 2010 11:39 AM PDT up reply actions
I think Mora looked smug like he deserved to be there (which is based on clips I saw)
There is a certain amount of entitlement there. It comes through in a lot things he did/and still does on T.V.. I like seeing Carroll with the team, he has a command, and a confidence that Mora never had (again based on clips.)
At least we aren't the Raiders?
by Generzal Zod on Apr 14, 2010 12:17 PM PDT up reply actions
I think so too.
Everything about how he dresses and acts should inspire contempt but it doesn’t. I’m trying to figure out if I’m just always too optimistic. I really felt like he had a coach’s presence in the clips I saw. Less Mora-like cheerleading than a real, contagious optimism. He said something about how it was just a little mini-camp but that it was special to the team…
by BurtonOerney on Apr 14, 2010 1:37 PM PDT up reply actions
I agree John
Mora was put into a no win situation and i thought he and Ruskell should have been given one more year after so many inuries. I loved the Dirtbag comment which was so true but hated the Mare bashing. His defensive play calling of sending 3 or 4 rushers vs 6 blocks made ZERO sense to me. Anyways, it is time to move on and hope for the best!
Yeah. Mare really liked him.
The Seahawks have traded my signature to the Detroit Lions for a 6th round draft pick.
So did Chris Spencer.
At least we aren't the Raiders?
by Generzal Zod on Apr 13, 2010 6:56 PM PDT up reply actions
But not that pussy Nick Reed.
The Seahawks have traded my signature to the Detroit Lions for a 6th round draft pick.
We haven't sacrificed enough virgins to him?
At least we aren't the Raiders?
by Generzal Zod on Apr 13, 2010 7:02 PM PDT up reply actions
We ran out of them. Tiger and Ben went on a rampage and tapped everything in sight.
The Seahawks have traded my signature to the Detroit Lions for a 6th round draft pick.
Tiki too
It's a Casio on a plastic beach
by Roy Weaver Stuckey on Apr 13, 2010 7:04 PM PDT up reply actions
PFT: More than 10 teams have taken Dez Bryant off their draft boards
“One such team, we’re told, is the Seahawks.”
That’s disappointing. I love Dez Bryant. Although if we get Marshall, it’s not a big deal.
Stop saying that
Schneider will hear you.
At least we aren't the Raiders?
by Generzal Zod on Apr 13, 2010 6:52 PM PDT up reply actions
And will use both first round picks on him.
It’s the old Schneidy-double-down-deal. He’s got some great negotiating skills.
by PRIDEin253 on Apr 13, 2010 7:33 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
DONT! GIVE! HIM! IDEAS!
At least we aren't the Raiders?
by Generzal Zod on Apr 13, 2010 8:07 PM PDT up reply actions
He's a stud. We'd just have to install 900 digital clocks at the V-Mac like Holmgren did for K-Rob in Kirkland
and hope that he doesn’t develop a taste for ecstasy and booze.
He played in a pass happy spread offense against Big 10 defenses and doesn't look to have special athleticism.
I guess the same was said of Crabtree though.
Crabtree is like Suh, in my opinion.
Not the perfect athlete, but if you wanted to build a WR/DT, they would look a lot like Crabtree/Suh.
Anyone hear Marcellus Wiley?
He said the next destination Marshall might go to besides Seattle would be SF… If that happened I would be pissed!
It's a Casio on a plastic beach
by Roy Weaver Stuckey on Apr 13, 2010 7:03 PM PDT up reply actions
I could see that trade....
But do the 49ers want to trade a pick for Marshall and ALSO pay him a $40-50 million contract, after drafting Crabtree last year? And probably paying Vernon Davis some more coin soon? I don’t think the Niners FO has as big of pockets as us to swallow that.
But it wouldn’t shock me if they did it.
I think he has elite speed for his size and is an explosive athlete. Even his kick/punt return skills impressed me.
Couple that with a 38 inch vertical and you’ve got one hell of a big play WR.
If he turns out to be a bust, it won’t be because of any physical shortcomings.
Good
I wouldn’t want to spend the 14th pick on him when veteran WRs are getting traded for nothing
It's a Casio on a plastic beach
by Roy Weaver Stuckey on Apr 13, 2010 6:52 PM PDT up reply actions
Where is he expected to go?
It's a Casio on a plastic beach
by Roy Weaver Stuckey on Apr 13, 2010 6:55 PM PDT up reply actions
60th overall pick?
It's a Casio on a plastic beach
by Roy Weaver Stuckey on Apr 13, 2010 6:56 PM PDT up reply actions
It reminds me of the 1998 draft when a top ten receiver dropped all the way to 21 for character
And to think at 15 Seattle was a possible destination for Randy Moss. Joey Galloway and Randy Moss could have turned Air Kitna into the greatest show on turf before the greatest show on turf existed. Instead we took Anthony SImmons. Live and learn I guess.
good to point out
It's a Casio on a plastic beach
by Roy Weaver Stuckey on Apr 13, 2010 7:01 PM PDT up reply actions
Anthony Simmons was awesome
And I assume still is, somewhere.
If nowhere else, he is still awesome in Madden 2005, and nobody can take that away from him.
Yes, I was playing Madden 2005 this week. When you’re scanning the rosters and you realize Rick Mirer is still in the game, you realize it’s time to upgrade your game.
Not that it matters that much, but how about Gibbs putting Chris Spencer at the most cerebral position in practice
Fuck you racists.
by John Morgan on Apr 13, 2010 6:57 PM PDT reply actions 2 recs
I was actually surprised
Some reason I thought Unger would be there.
They obviously value Spencer with the tender they put on him.
It's a Casio on a plastic beach
by Roy Weaver Stuckey on Apr 13, 2010 7:02 PM PDT up reply actions
Spencer is smart - I think he got a little jumpy
oh and the broken hand thing didn’t help either
At least we aren't the Raiders?
by Generzal Zod on Apr 13, 2010 7:03 PM PDT up reply actions
He is smart.
Just not confident. It would thrill me to no end to see Gibbs worked him into a warrior.
by John Morgan on Apr 13, 2010 7:04 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Is the confidence due to leading the line that he had the last two years?
At least we aren't the Raiders?
by Generzal Zod on Apr 13, 2010 7:06 PM PDT up reply actions
Me too.
He has the strength to do some damage vs. those pesky behemoth NTs, like Frankin in SF.
Early prospect watch: RB C.J. Spiller, QB Sam Bradford, OT Ciron Black*, DT Gerald McCoy, S Eric Berry, DT Ndamukong Suh, CB Ras-I Dowling**, RB Jonathan Dwyer
I fear Unger, Spencer, or Canfield having to face Suh twice a year for a 6 years
I really hope the take Bradford.
At least we aren't the Raiders?
by Generzal Zod on Apr 13, 2010 7:25 PM PDT up reply actions
He also is 6'3"
As Gibbs put it when discussing guards and centers, “Height and length doesn’t mean ****….Nobody over 6’3”.
So maybe Spencer and Unger are both “football brilliant” but Unger doesn’t have the right build.
Their line doesn't really fit his mold
he did whip them together in a hurry though.
At least we aren't the Raiders?
by Generzal Zod on Apr 13, 2010 7:18 PM PDT up reply actions
Yeah, I worry about Unger.
How he fits..of course, Vallos is around, and this is the team that locked out Sims and Tapp—so it’s not into veiling motives.
Hell yes.
I would love that. I would also love Mora to be an analyst when he gets elected to 5 straight Pro Bowls.
...Says the biggest racist on Field Gulls.
You CLEARLY hate Brian Russell because he sucks AND he’s white, not despite his skin color.
The Seahawks have traded my signature to the Detroit Lions for a 6th round draft pick.
That's true I think Babs sucks as badly
but I hate him way less.
At least we aren't the Raiders?
by Generzal Zod on Apr 13, 2010 7:08 PM PDT up reply actions
and the inability to make a tackle didn't help either.
At least we aren't the Raiders?
by Generzal Zod on Apr 13, 2010 7:10 PM PDT up reply actions
Yet you love Nick Reed because he has all the skills and features of a black guy
Actually…I think he’s black but he gave himself vitiligo.
The Seahawks have traded my signature to the Detroit Lions for a 6th round draft pick.
Reed embodies the full spectrum of light. Don't short change the man. He's a freakin' chameleon.
by Kevaru on Apr 13, 2010 7:13 PM PDT up reply actions 10 recs
Geez.
Am I the only one bored by Nick Reed jokes? I must have missed the catalyst. Wouldn’t be the first time…
How about that Tiki Barber
seems like a pretty decent guy
by Anticitizen_One on Apr 13, 2010 7:11 PM PDT reply actions
I love how the Giants won it all the year after he left
It's a Casio on a plastic beach
by Roy Weaver Stuckey on Apr 13, 2010 7:13 PM PDT up reply actions
after he started a spat with Manning about his leadership on T.V. and Manning called him out
then Manning takes the team on a bad ass run through the playoffs.
At least we aren't the Raiders?
by Generzal Zod on Apr 13, 2010 7:15 PM PDT up reply actions
I think that was supposed to be pretty sarcastic.
At least we aren't the Raiders?
by Generzal Zod on Apr 14, 2010 12:20 PM PDT up reply actions
How long do you expect Gibbs transformation of the o-line to take?
Is there enough existing talent to just add a first round tackle and a couple guards off the trash heap and have an average line?
The Texans had a few 3rd rounders and first round pick
and he traded for a guy from Denver and they got a lot better I think they had a pretty offense last year.
At least we aren't the Raiders?
by Generzal Zod on Apr 13, 2010 7:20 PM PDT up reply actions
With Gibbs, it's almost like you can't say no.
He is, what, the most famous position coach in NFL history? I don’t want to bank on him, but I certainly do not underestimate him.
Carroll said today that he hopes Lawyer Milloy re-signs with the team.
I hope he’s not being considered a viable starter. Although I guess we could trot him out twice a year to scare the crap out of Crabtree.
Can't find it.
There’s a still image of him ducking though.
The Seahawks have traded my signature to the Detroit Lions for a 6th round draft pick.
Can someone post that
I gotta save that one, I love it
by Thomas Beekers on Apr 14, 2010 4:57 AM PDT up reply actions
The Seahawks are not going to draft two Safeties
Right now we got Babs and Jamar Adams. Add whichever kid we draft, and…..well, we still need another safety. Milloy played for Carroll when they were both with the Pats, so I’m sure there’s a desire to have at least one guy in the secondary that is experienced with this new defense.
And what if the Seahawks whiff at safety to fill other needs, or to get players they like more? There are plenty of reasons why Carroll would want him around.
What does everyone think of Arrelious Benn?
I see the next anquan boldin. Hopefully without the broken face.
by nickfru1 on Apr 13, 2010 7:47 PM PDT via mobile reply actions
Hard to say guy supposedly has a ton of talent
but he didn’t have a competent QB his entire time in college.
[DELETED ZOMG NO POLITICS]
I live in NYC and I will be attending the draft.
Any other hawk fans going?
by nickfru1 on Apr 13, 2010 7:49 PM PDT via mobile reply actions
It's only today I remembered Edgerrin James was a Seahawk.
Imagine what would’ve happened if we had kept him for the full season and Forsett never got to see as much field time as he did.
The Seahawks have traded my signature to the Detroit Lions for a 6th round draft pick.
What does everyone think of taking Stafon Johnson
with our 7th round pick?
People should look at the link posted in the fan shots about Stafon by the way..
I hope he is the one guy Carroll takes from USC
He’s the anti-Beast Mode, he’s smart. If he were at any other school that didn’t have 8 different 5 star running backs he’d be a top ten pick.
At least we aren't the Raiders?
by Generzal Zod on Apr 13, 2010 8:36 PM PDT up reply actions
If he hadn't dropped a weight bar across his throat you mean.
by Trojan Knight on Apr 13, 2010 8:50 PM PDT up reply actions
Hasa any said whether it will limit his career?
At least we aren't the Raiders?
by Generzal Zod on Apr 13, 2010 8:52 PM PDT up reply actions
that is what I get for typing and watching Tosh.O
At least we aren't the Raiders?
by Generzal Zod on Apr 13, 2010 8:54 PM PDT up reply actions
Dude could have a biological jet pack sprout from his ass and not be a top ten pick.
He is, however, a good fit for a ZBS and should definitely be a NDFA.
by John Morgan on Apr 13, 2010 8:54 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
I have a Microbiology degree
And it’s time I put this shit to work. I need to go into my lab and start work on the A.M.B.J; Ass Mounted Biological Jetpack. Move over aqueducts, there’s a new scientific marvel in town!
I like his size for our system. He cannot be worse than Julius Jones and is certainly better than Rankin
He also has a tremendous work ethic.
by Trojan Knight on Apr 13, 2010 9:10 PM PDT up reply actions
He was my favorite back of the trio at USC
so I’d love this but not in any rational or logical sort of way.
[DELETED ZOMG NO POLITICS]
Marshall to the Fins
Denver receives a #43 and what’s believed to be the 2011 2nd rounder.
I’m sorry he’s not a Hawk, but geez, I’m more glad they didn’t outbid that offer. Denver got basically their asking price of a low first-rounder’s worth of picks.
by SeahawksFanInNY on Apr 14, 2010 6:33 AM PDT reply actions
Agree
That price is too high for us. I wonder this: what’s the point of us driving down his price for a month if Miami swoops in at the 11th hour and overpays?. 2 second rounders ain’t far off from a first…
Can't blame the front office here
The “point” of driving down the price is trying to get a better price from us. If some team wants to foolishly and hastily overpay by such a large degree more than the current highest bidder, what options do you have other than trying to be a bigger fool, or shrugging and walking away?
by SeahawksFanInNY on Apr 14, 2010 7:20 AM PDT up reply actions
I mean, the Fin's offer even exceeds offering #40 straight up, and by a fair bit.
The Aragorn deal didn’t submarine our chances here.
by SeahawksFanInNY on Apr 14, 2010 7:25 AM PDT up reply actions
Oh to be clear, I am lambasting Miami's FO, not ours
I’d be curious with what our offer was, but I’m not mad at Q/PM on this one…
I think he looks a little more like George Harrison in the All Things Must Pass era.
I know he didn’t lead the kingdom of men into the New Age of Middle Earth or anything but he was the glue that held together Lennon and McCartney that has to count for something.
At least we aren't the Raiders?
by Generzal Zod on Apr 14, 2010 8:42 AM PDT up reply actions
This could be payback...
how do we know the Dolphins weren’t hoping to get Whitehurst for a 6th?
It may be okay for them
They have cleaned up their o-line Chad Henne is showing promise and progress of being a good NFL QB, they have a good running game. They got Marshall to fill a need and they can use their first round pick to tighten up a decent defense.
At least we aren't the Raiders?
by Generzal Zod on Apr 14, 2010 10:06 AM PDT up reply actions
So not worth 2 high picks where we are now.
Anyone else notice that the deal tanked after both Williams boys put in a full day of practice? And they cost zippety doo dah, and will behave a lot better, too.
Don’t worry, though, Marshall fans, he’ll be in camp doing the same thing they are pretty soon…
I was jumping up and down excited when Who’s-yer-mama came to town, but after awhile noticed that when the QB is too busy running for his life, picking himself up off the ground or watching the game on tv because he’s injured, that great receivers don’t make nearly as much difference as great linemen. And we can have 2 now that we took a pass on BM.
The BM will always find a way to get out.
According to ESPN, he received a four-year, $47 million contract extension for a total deal of five years and $50 million. That included $24 million in guaranteed money.
When we do have a salary cap again that is a lot space to eat up, and it is not like a contract to stroke the ego of an old veteran because I am sure Marshall will be there all four years. What if they want to resign him after that? It will only go up. That is a lot to invest in a guy like Marshall who is such a wild card. I don’t know enough about Schneider and Carroll’s will to say they could handle him but something tells me Parcells and Soprano Sporano can.
At least we aren't the Raiders?
by Generzal Zod on Apr 14, 2010 10:13 AM PDT up reply actions
This will probably get buried if John makes a new thread for today
But to me, the two interesting stories for this minicamp are 1) what does the O-line look like heading toward the draft and 2) what’s up with Aaron Curry (and what that tells us about the defense). The beat writers have been hitting the O-line well enough, but I haven’t read anything on Curry other than he’s with the linebacker group (Sando).
I’d love to hear more about how the defense is lining up, but then again this is a pre-draft minicamp and it’s probably more about drills at this point, and/or a chance for the organization to see some of the incumbent players once or twice before they finalize their draft board.
Is there reason now...
for us to hold off on a RB since they have short careers and we are not exactly close to contention?
McCoy will be gone.
So, perhaps Trent.
Early prospect watch: RB C.J. Spiller, QB Sam Bradford, OT Ciron Black*, DT Gerald McCoy, S Eric Berry, DT Ndamukong Suh, CB Ras-I Dowling**, RB Jonathan Dwyer
Seahawks working Ray Willis at LT and Locklear at RT...
I’d say it was because we just needed more or less a ‘warm body’ to play LT, but if Lock is practicing at RT what does this mean? Anything? I’m not sure Willis can hang vs. the pass-rushers he’ll face at LT. Are they just having a look?
Ray Willis was the Seahawks’ first-team left tackle as the team opened its first voluntary minicamp on Tuesday.
Early prospect watch: RB C.J. Spiller, QB Sam Bradford, OT Ciron Black*, DT Gerald McCoy, S Eric Berry, DT Ndamukong Suh, CB Ras-I Dowling**, RB Jonathan Dwyer
Willis is not a starting LT.
Spencer/Unger are legitimate starters at guard. Locklear should start at RT. We don’t really have an NFL-starting caliber player at center or left tackle. I think Spencer can develop at center. We shouldn’t make the same mistake with him that we made with Kevin Mawae.
When you look at the draft years for great left tackles, there are long droughts and talent spikes. ‘96-’97 was a spike. Walter Jones, Jonathan Ogden, Orlando Pace and Alan Faneca all came out then. In 1980-‘81, Joe Jacoby was drafted by the Redskins and Anthony Munoz went to Cincinatti. Michael Oher and Jason Smith went last year and played like champs. Maybe we’re seeing another tackle renaissance.
by BurtonOerney on Apr 14, 2010 3:15 PM PDT up reply actions

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