The Good, The Bad, and The Ugly In The Seahawks Loss to the Falcons
by Danny Kelly on Oct 4, 2011 8:01 AM PDT
in Seahawks Game Recaps
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There's a lot you can say about this game after the first watch and I've already said a lot about it in other posts. It was a lot of fun to watch, for starters. There were a lot of positive things that sound like cliches to takeaway from the game, as well. Now that I've had nearly 36 hours to digest it, let's take a look at the good, bad, and ugly from this game.
The Good:
Things I've already talked about: Doug Baldwin has been by far the best undrafted free agent rookie in the NFL thus far this year (as far as I know, anyway). He is now playing in front of Golden Tate and in a lot of cases, Ben Obomanu, and with good right. Dude caught five passes for 84 yards and took a couple really tough hits.
Along those lines, it was nice to see Mike Williams get targets -- he had five, by the way -- and catch three passes, one for a touchdown. Baby steps to getting him more involved. He also had a pretty badass crack-back block on the Marshawn Lynch TD run to break him free and concussed himself doing so. Honestly, go back and re-watch that block, it was pretty nice.
Zach Miller got six targets, catching three, and should have had four and a touchdown but got lit up pretty good in the endzone. I'm sure he'll have nightmares about not holding on to that ball but what can you do? It was a good defensive play.
Jon Ryan had another good day. He punted three times (only three times?!?) and averaged 49.7 yards per punt, his long being 57 yards. Looks like he's still a good player, albeit one with a boring haircut.
The Hawks gave up some pretty key third down conversions to the Falcons but were actually a hair behind Atlanta on third downs percentage wise, going 6-11 (55%) to the Falcons 9-16 (56%). Converting over half of your third downs is a good thing.
Steven Hauschka missed that 61-yard field goal (I don't know if you heard about that or not), but he actually did well on kickoffs, sending 4 out of 5 into the endzone, and those four were downed for touchbacks. Notice how our special teams didn't really screw the pooch in this game? That was nice.
The Hawks went 3 out of 4 in the redzone, which you can't really complain about. That fourth chance that went for naught? The dropped pass in the endzone by Zach Miller.
I thought that Tarvaris Jackson played well. He was statistically better than Matt Ryan in pretty much every category and he led his team back to put them in a position to potentially win. Let's hope this is some sort of turning point for the offense and not just an anomaly.
I liked when the Seahawks used the hurry-up, no-huddle offense and they did well in doing so. According to Doug Farrar's charting, the Hawks ran 12 plays out of the no-huddle, Tarvaris going 5 of 8 for 47 yards passing with the running backs gaining 18 yards on four attempts. Not too shabby, and something I'm sure we'll see more of because it's obvious this team feels comfortable moving quickly.
The Bad:
I'm not saying that the passing game was anything but impressive in this game, but I'm kind of bummed that our tight ends aren't getting as many targets. After seeing how dominant John Carlson, Anthony McCoy, Zach Miller, and even Dominique Byrd were in the preseason and training camp, I was expecting more from the guys that survived long enough to see the field (ie, I realize that Carlson and Byrd are gone). Now, obviously the first couple of games Miller stayed in to pass block a lot more but I'm really hoping they start looking for Anthony McCoy and Zach Miller in the passing game more as we go along.
Matt McCoy hurt his knee badly. Like, disgustingly. Despite that awful display of human bone/muscle/tendon flexibility, it's looking like he may not need surgery and may not even have to go on the IR. If that's true, hooray!
Giving up 30 points and going down by 20 at one point early in the 3rd quarter can be considered 'bad.' The Seahawks were down 27-7 with 13:40 in the 3rd quarter and at that point I'm sure a lot of people were settling in for a boring and depressing 2nd half. That wasn't so, of course, but how bout the Seahawks try and get off to a little bit quicker start?
Slow starts have been the bane of the Seahawks existence this season. The Hawks got shut out in the first half of both the San Francisco and Pittsburgh games, averaging something like 57 total yards of offense in the first half of those games. Against the Cardinals, they scored six points on 128 yards of offense and went into the locker room down 10-6.
Continuing... I'd like to see more than 53 yards of rushing. A big part of this is obviously that the Hawks were airing it out in a comeback attempt, so I'm fine with it in this case, but they really didn't have much success running in the first half when it was still a game (before it became a game again), and it's something to improve on.
The Ugly:
Penalties, man. Stop it. Sidney Rice picked up a few dumb penalties. Browner is pretty much a penalty magnet. That offsides on Raheem Brock late in the game -- I don't even want to get started. Discipline, discipline, discipline. I know it's a lot to ask from a young team but the guys that killed us this week - Rice and Brock - are not rookies. Annoying.
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Totally Agree
Solid, exciting play in the Second Half, but those frickin Penalties are killer…C’mon Guys
Make It Matter
No mention of Curry's pretty good game
Defense didn’t have a good game as a whole tho. Wanna look at McDonald.
Formerly knows as Vasilii, follow me on twitter @dolgorukii
You're right about Curry
I need to go back and look at both of those things as I re-watch the game.
"Scored a Deer Head" - Scruffy Lefty
Field Gulls | Follow me on the Twitters
watch curry on the 21-yard turner touchdown run
and then we’ll discuss how good a game he had.
as always, he does some good things here and there, and then deflates the good balloon with a big bonehead play.
One play does not negate a good game
As usual though, he did misread that play as a playfake. That seems to be his consistent problem. His assignment was covering the tight end though, so the main problem is not him, but the two people who have weakside contain (Clemons and Hawthorne) and are blocked out by single blockers.
Formerly knows as Vasilii, follow me on twitter @dolgorukii
by Thomas Beekers on Oct 4, 2011 9:39 AM PDT up reply actions
That's right.
Clemons is the one who really shit the bed on that play. Without contain, it’s easy peasy for the RB.
To be fair, Clemons has been better than expected on run defense mostly
But this highlights once again how easily he can be blocked out even by a single man. That just comes with the Leo concept.
Formerly knows as Vasilii, follow me on twitter @dolgorukii
by Thomas Beekers on Oct 4, 2011 10:38 AM PDT up reply actions
Oh yeah, trust me, I know.
But the Leo end doesn’t have backside contain responsibility?
In this situation, I think so, yes
Maybe I’m mistaken though
Formerly knows as Vasilii, follow me on twitter @dolgorukii
by Thomas Beekers on Oct 4, 2011 11:14 AM PDT up reply actions
If not, it's gotta be the outside linebacker.
Maybe one of Clemons or Curry didn’t know the play.
Yeah, maybe
People like to make very definitive statements on those type of plays but the truth is that’s really hard to do from the outside looking in. Curry looks like he’s tracking the TE because he should but his assignment may not have been so strict. He’s making a mistake either way, but it’s an open question if it breaks up primarily because of him.
Formerly knows as Vasilii, follow me on twitter @dolgorukii
by Thomas Beekers on Oct 4, 2011 11:46 AM PDT up reply actions
I'd be very interested in some observations on McDonald
It seems like he’s seeing a good amount of action, but being that I usually watch games at a sports bar, and given the nature of bars, I don’t usually focus on d-line rotations or individual play as much as I’d like.
Penalties!
It’s amazing how focus of a coach from one area to another can actually be noticeable. I have no stats here so this might just be a viewer bias based fallacy but it seemed that when Holmgren coached he focused on penalties a lot more and we had a lot less.
(This is not a Holmgren was a better coach post or anything silly like that, just talking about one specific area)
Holmgren openly talked about penalties and wore his frustration w/ them on his sleeve
I think PC is also equally frustrated by them, but he does not speak about the negative aspects of a player or the teams gain in the same way Mike did. Pete focuses on positives and how we can get better, instead of stating specifics about short comings.
I have to think PC is being a little more tolerant of penalties given the sheer number of issues and areas to address given the roster turnover and short offseason. I’m sure it’s on the list and beginning to become stack ranked a little higher now that other issues are getting resolved.
Holmgren also wouldn't have fielded such a young team to begin with
He tended to favor his veterans and expected they could play mistake free.
by SmartAssCoug on Oct 4, 2011 11:37 AM PDT up reply actions
Loved the O-line
I thought the offensive line had an awesome game. No tackles for loss for the Falcons and I didn’t hear John Abraham’s name called once. James Carpenter is getting much better every week and this was Okung’s best game of the season.
by UltimateSeahawksFan on Oct 4, 2011 9:05 AM PDT reply actions
I think it is clear that our pass-blocking improved
but other than “no tackles for loss” I’m not sure how great they were in the run game. Maybe Danny could do a great writeup on this with some of those excellent pictures with the white arrows he does?
Eternally looking forward to someone making a Seahawks song based off of Lil' Jon's "Shots" song named "Hawks!"
On the kick that did not result in a touchback
You have to consider that it was after a 15 yard penalty (Rice; throat slashing gesture after TD, unsportsmanlike). Without the penalty, it was 5 yards deep in the EZ.
by GoSeaHox on Oct 4, 2011 9:28 AM PDT reply actions 1 recs
Seattle averages the 6th most penalties in the NFL (actually the entire NFC West is in the bottom half)
And their penalties (accepted) per game has more than doubled from 3.4 to 7.8 since 2007.
At the end of that disastrous 2008 season they were still only average about 4 per game.
You have to wonder if at some point this has less to do with “experience” and rookie mistakes and a lot to do with poor coaching and emphasizing team discipline. Raheem Brock is not a rookie. Brandon Browner has been playing professionally for several years and the CFL has practically the same rules.
I hate it. This has to stop.
I respect your opinion even though it's wrong.
Browner was something of a star in the CFL
He probably got away with more than he does now that he’s a nobody on a nowhere team.
by Highwatermark on Oct 4, 2011 10:05 AM PDT up reply actions
He got away with more because the passing systems are different
The receivers run towards the LOS like the Arena League.
Also, Kevin Kolb may be terrible but he’s better than some of the current actual CFL QBs like ex-Seahawk SAFETY Kerry Joseph, Henry Burris, Travis Lulay, Buck Pierce….hell Timmy Chang I think was playing for Hamilton for a short while.
I respect your opinion even though it's wrong.
See response above
I think it’s more a matter of, it’s important, but there are other issues that need addressing and only so much time and resources to do it. Now that these penalties are showing up more and rising to the top if the issues list (and other issues have fallen off) I suspect it will get more time and attention.
Agreed.
This is not a disciplined team. To an extent it’s because it’s young, but as you say, even veterans are making bonehead mistakes.
I also don’t like the show of attitude (Curry, Rice) when you’re down by a ton. Wow, you made a play, great. Shut up and make another one.
Would you rather
they approached making a touchdown they same way they do finding a nickel under the couch? Making big plays is worth getting excited over.
"That's funny. I post here all the time and I never see (you) here."
- GreatGoogly, to John Morgan
"John Morgan IS Field Gulls, asshole!"
Hate that cliche statement
There aint anythin wrong wit celebratin a big play. No matter what that dumbass Goodell says.
And Bill Belicheck says
“Celebrate, you’ve worked your ass off and earned it.” Seriously, who cares?
GRAB MAH DICK
by Stay Off the Flowers on Oct 4, 2011 12:22 PM PDT up reply actions
A good
The fake catch by BMW which fooled the Falcons CB into leaving Obomanu wide open for his TD catch. Amused me greatly
Apologies for misident...
…probably not expecting Tate to be that smart
So apparently
T-Jack is NOT the worst QB in the history of the NFL (or even the Seahawks).
He just eclipsed most of Dan McGwire’s passing numbers in one fewer career start.
Plus, Tarvaris isn’t a first round draft pick and QBOTF who we liked better than Brett Favre. See, I told you guys you were all overreacting!
Tarvaris Jackson once threw 4 touchdown passes and helped blow out the future NFC Champion Cardinals
What we just saw is the best we’ll ever get out of Tarvaris.
I respect your opinion even though it's wrong.
I'll take this.
If that was his best, we are set. What I think you probablly should be thinking is, can this be sustained and consistant. At least that’s what I’m wondering.
...weeks 1 and 3 performances are going to be the norm
He’s never shown any bit of consistently good showings ever.
I respect your opinion even though it's wrong.
We'll see
I’m not bold enough to argue with you at this point. It is interesting, that when the O-line finally steps up and does a fantastic job protecting him and he has a good game, so many folks write it off as an anomoly and point to the games he did poorly and wasn’t given protection. These responses appear more biased based, then objective.
As a fan of the team (not talent evaluator), I can only cheer him on to be what we need from him, a real quality QB, capable of making defenses frustrated on a consistant basis. This is a start. Next step for me, is seeing him do it consistantly at home, and then on the road.
Be nice if we didn’t have to trade our draft for a #1 QB, over spend or spend at al in the top of the draft. Course, I support doing it if we need to- just rather not have to.
by GnarlyHawk on Oct 4, 2011 10:34 AM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
I expect him to revert to the mean.
No QB gets 20+ starts by being purely horrible, there have to be enough good performances sprinkled in to justify playing him more.
This is the Vikings cycle started all over again.
70% of space is covered by dark matter, the rest by ET.
I'm missing your point.
Formerly knows as Vasilii, follow me on twitter @dolgorukii
by Thomas Beekers on Oct 4, 2011 10:13 AM PDT up reply actions
That there is hope and we should all be measured in our reactions.
There is a bright spot here, and many over reacted negatively to TJ being the QB and found every reason possible to blame him for our poor performances.
Ideally, he proves he’s a franchise QB and we can invest in other areas of need. Thats the hope part.
Let’s all breathe and observe the whole season this year, before making absolute judgements regarding TJ’s value to the team and capability as a QB in this system. We should also not be setting our emotional response conditions at this point in the season, like many have.
Eh, it's football, people will always react emotionally
As for me, I’ve seen Tarvaris for most of his career, and as I’ve said before, I think his upside is a mediocre game manager. That’s where he’ll be at ideally if all the pieces continue to slot into place. I enjoy seeing him do well against a poor defense like here, though, it shows Carroll’s vision on putting pieces around the QB to have him succeed has some merit.
Formerly knows as Vasilii, follow me on twitter @dolgorukii
by Thomas Beekers on Oct 4, 2011 10:40 AM PDT up reply actions
There are some excellent pieces sliding into place.
This WR corps looks really, really dangerous, particularly if you factor in decent TE play. The team has put a lot of resources into the offensive line, too.
Whomever they draft next year to play QB could certainly come on to a team with some good personnel.
It won't be anything like Bradford getting thrown to the wolves.
More like Big Ben’s start in Pittsburgh.
70% of space is covered by dark matter, the rest by ET.
Let's hope it ends the same way.
Just, uh, with the Seahawks WINNING this one.
Uh, he's still bad.
He’s played 3 good quarters out of 16 possible. The fact that the offense has racked up points and yards in those 3 quarters that he’s played good makes it pretty clear to me, that he is the problem.
70% of space is covered by dark matter, the rest by ET.
Let me see if I got this:
“Sure, he and the team played well. But that doesn’t count, or matter, because all the times the entire team played like crap – it was 100% completely his fault.”
Man, you must really hate Tarvaris Jackson for some reason.
Hate is such a strong word.
But look at the way opposing D’s have played us. Steelers and Niners stacked the box and dared TJ to throw. Couldn’t do it.
Falcons and Cards have bad D’s but still dared TJ to throw and this is where he had success. And once he established the threat to throw, the line and running game got “better”.
The only games I see us being competitive in are against teams that have defenses that are so bad they make TJ look competent.
70% of space is covered by dark matter, the rest by ET.
Niners
We were in a position to win the game in the final few minutes. A complete meltdown by the special teams is what killed us. Not Tarvaris.
Tarvaris didn't kill us?
Well 0 points in the first half of that game despite the defense shutting down San Fran in the red zone sure isn’t a good sign.
I respect your opinion even though it's wrong.
See,
is exactly what I mean. You know what IS a good sign? Him leading us all the way back to within two and giving us a chance to win that game.
I wouldn't bother trying to attribute black or white reasoning to other people's posts.
I haven’t seen a single poster here that said the only thing wrong with this team is Jackson.
The main problem? The primary problem?
Are you really going to argue about one word? I’m pretty sure hazbro isn’t saying that he’s the only problem….
…is he? Heh.
The fact that the offense has racked up points and yards in those 3 quarters that he’s played good makes it pretty clear to me, that he is the problem.
I dont know. That seems pretty definitive.
Though I disagree with his logic.
People tend to take results and twist them to suit their own personal biases. Which clearly happens a lot with Tarvaris.
To be more specific.
The main, primary problem.
As in this is an offense that will score a lot of points with good QB play on a regular basis.
70% of space is covered by dark matter, the rest by ET.
I conquer with Hazbro
But that does not mean I think we are completely helpless. The Tavaris precedent is not pretty but hopefully he continues his hotstreak of 3 quarters.
Ok
But this is kind of a “duh” moment. Unfortunately there isn’t a “consistently good QB” available nor is there one in the entirety of the NFC West. So how do you propose we solve this problem? Play without a QB?
It's
just like everyone appears to act like we are the only team without a franchise QB. This is far from the case.
Now you're changing the parameters of the discussion.
Not conducive to reasonable conversation.
by Stay Off the Flowers on Oct 4, 2011 12:21 PM PDT up reply actions
No
The parameters of the discussion are:
Tarvaris Jackson does/does not deserve to be criticised for everything he does, including winning or putting us in a position to win.
I don’t see how I have changed that.
It's pretty apparent from watching the games
that the game planning/adjustments and play calling were different than in the 3 “good quarters.” The coaching staff was obviously being extremely conservative in the first half of the 9er game, the entire Pittsburg game, and with the lead in the Az game.
When TJ’s been asked (or allowed) to be aggressive (second half 9ers, beginning of the 3rd Q in the AZ game, and second half of the Atl game) he has been pretty effective.
So from what I have seen, I don’t think Jekyll/Hyde offensive scoring performances are directly attributable to inconsistent QB play. I am not saying TJ has been without fault or completely consistent; just that he has been much more consistent than just looking at scoring would lead one to conclude.
by moxr on Oct 4, 2011 2:18 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
TJax...
…played a fine game, beginning to end (even so, doesn’t negate his previous poor performances, nor predict the future…but that’s not what this post is about).
Even the first half, he looked good. Competent. Decisive. Much better pocket presense. The TD to Rice (although on a free play) was an excellent throw. Even better, in my opinion, were the other shots he took down the field, even when he wasn’t on a penalty. Very nice to see.
He also threw several strikes down the field, to Baldwin, Miller. Yes, he missed a TD throw to Obo, but I have seen every QB to ever play the game do that on occasion.
The TD toss to Obo was sweet, and took patience on TJax’s part, something we haven’t seen before.
Yes, he missed some throws and threw a couple of picks, but as has been stated, the pick to Miller was a nice play on TJax’s part. Miller holds on – TD.
The other pick was acceptable as well, throwing to BMW. Willingness to throw to BMW is a huge improvement, in my opinion.
His scrambles were strategic and effective, and not panic-driven – again, a very positive improvement.
Not sure if he can maintain this level of play – I guess we’ll see – but honestly, this type of QB play was pretty much the best I would expect of CW, so PC obviously knew what he was doing.
Maybe Atlanta’s defense isn’t very good – likely – but it doesn’t matter. We watched competent QB play and it made all the difference.
Congrats to TJax on a game very well played.
About the 2011 Seahawks: "And if I laugh at any mortal thing, tis that I may not weep." Byron
by Hawksince77 on Oct 4, 2011 3:14 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Agreed and additionally to the comments that Sunday was a career day
or we can expect to see this only a couple times a season… ok if Sunday was TJ’s “A” game and the first three games were TJ’s “C” games, I am frankly ok with a “B” game.
That would probably be in the 35-60% percentile of NFL QBs and is a more than adequate bridge to a QBOTF candidate.
Well, he made the game watchable, fun, competitive, and with a young team looking to grow...
…that’s pretty damn good.
It was so painful before to watch, and so much more fun against Atlanta, it makes all the difference for a fan.
About the 2011 Seahawks: "And if I laugh at any mortal thing, tis that I may not weep." Byron
And one more thing...
…there was a pass in the corner of the endzone to Rice that was spot on – a sure TD if that 5’9" corner hadn’t elevated something like 5 feet to tip the ball away. Great throw by TJax, incredible play by the DB.
About the 2011 Seahawks: "And if I laugh at any mortal thing, tis that I may not weep." Byron
Two other bads
Pass rush – one of the Falcons big issues coming into the game was its o-line and keeping Ryan upright, and I think people were looking forward to a big day for Clemons after last week’s performance. Well, we had no sacks, and only one tackle for a loss. Don’t remember Ryan being too hurried either.
Time of possession – okay, if you can’t run the ball you wont control the clock, but if NFL.com is to believed we had less than 20 minutes of possession, which is pretty astounding. Regardless, I can’t remember the last time we had the ball for half the game.
Agree
Funny how, if you take a game in isolation, you can paint very different pictures. When I watched this game, I could not help but think, our #1 need in the draft is a pass rush specialist. While not a credible way of assessing needs, it sure was humbling to see no pressure on a QB known for being pressured, eh?
Hey Danny.
You forgot to put Jackson’s Int. on our side of the 50yd line, In the Bad section, He (Jackson) throw the ball behind Williams allowing the defender to tip it in the air and then it was intercepted, That was a costly turnover…
That was the only interception so far I'd put on Jackson
It was a badly forced throw. It was more likely to just be an incomplete than an interception though, that was a bit of bad luck.
Formerly knows as Vasilii, follow me on twitter @dolgorukii
by Thomas Beekers on Oct 4, 2011 10:40 AM PDT up reply actions
A lot of plays can be considered 'bad'
but I think the point of the article is bigger takeaways. You could put any forward progress completion in the ‘Good’ section, too.
by Stay Off the Flowers on Oct 4, 2011 12:26 PM PDT up reply actions
Bigger 'takeaways' from the game, figuratively
not literal takeaways.
by Stay Off the Flowers on Oct 4, 2011 12:26 PM PDT up reply actions
I wonder if the Red Zone success can be attributed to
The fact that Atlanta hadn’t seen any tape of the Seahawks running plays in the Red Zone.
Under the 'bad' section, we have only 53 yards rushing. The flip (good) side of that...
…were the half-time adjustments, and the excellent screen passes, getting the ball to Forsett, Lynch on those, another form of rushing, that if added in, I would bet brings those yards up well over a hundred.
Just looked it up – Lynch with 33, Forsett with 30 and Washington with 4 – bringing the total yards for the RBs up to 120.
Not great, but not terrible, either. Plus, those effective plays helped open the passing game and slow down the pass rush.
About the 2011 Seahawks: "And if I laugh at any mortal thing, tis that I may not weep." Byron
I'm inclined to start calling Matt McCoy "Mr. Fantastic".
I’m sad he was put on injured reserve, but glad his injury wasn’t as bad as it looked (it looked reeeeeeeeally bad).
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