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Around SBN: The Most Dangerous Division in Sports

Seahawks Beat Rams: The Good, The Bad, & The Ugly

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This was a win, for sure, in the most technical sense of the word. It sure wasn't pretty and until very late in the game I don't remember feeling all to warm and fuzzy inside about what was happening. That being said, let's take a look at some of the good, bad and ugly from this game. 

The Good:

First - no major injuries. Now, the rest...

The defense. I keep coming back to this but it's become part of the identity of this team, but this defense has an attitude. It's that swagger that you see from elite teams and there's something almost tangible about the way the Seahawks play defense now. This week, they were led by Chris Clemons, who picked up three sacks and three quarterback hits, a pass defensed, and forced two fumbles that were recovered by the Seahawks.  This performance came against a new starting left tackle so it's not necessarily to be looked at as a 'breakout' or something that is easily repeatable but there's one pattern that I feel is emerging for Seattle, and that is - if Chris Clemons plays out of his mind, the defense dominates.

I think we've talked about this a lot over the season - the Seahawks defense might be one really consistent pass rusher away from being elite - and when Chris Clemons plays the way he did on Sunday, I think that theory holds true. Though there are obviously a few holes to fix - it'd be nice to have a Warren Sapp type 3-tech that could rack up 15 sacks over a season from inside - having a DE or two that can get to the quarterback and make his life miserable really allows the rest of the defense to lock down their opponent. 

This defense is built to stop the run. And it does that. If it had the capability to pressure the quarterback with any consistent success, boy oh boy. 

Another player that I thought played an excellent game was Brandon Mebane, who did a great job knifing through the line and making tackles for loss on at least two occasions. Alan Branch, Red Bryant, and Mebane really set a tone on the line and limited Steven Jackson to 42 yards on 15 attempts, a 2.8 ypc rate. That's pretty decent considering after that performance, Jackson is now down to 4.8 yards per carry on the season.

Some more good - the punting. Jon Ryan is quietly having a Pro Bowl year and averaged 49.7 yards per punt. This average included a partially blocked punt that went for 30 yards so if you throw that one out, his per punt clip goes to 52.1. He kicked the football 71-yards at one point. Deece. 

The rushing attack continued to gain some traction despite the offensive line losing it's right side. The Hawks went over 100 yards for the third straight game, and though they're picking up yardage the hard way - at 3.2 yards per carry yesterday - it's working in the time of possession category, something the Seahawks won 35:00-25:00 against the Rams. This goes back to helping the defense by keeping them off the field and fresh.

I liked that explosive plays stayed a big part of the offensive attack, and the Seahawks even scripted in their own first play as a trick end-around throw by former high school quarterback Sidney Rice that went for 55 yards. Tarvaris Jackson also completed a 35-yard pass to Doug Baldwin and Justin Forsett broke off a 22-yard run for a touchdown late in the game. 

I liked that the Seahawks made some big mistakes early and fell behind on the road, but bounced back first to get back into it then once in the lead they maintained control. We've seen the Seahawks, in recent years, fall behind early and completely fall apart. That's not happening anymore and it comes down to the players believing. 

Finally, another of the good things to come out of this game was the appearance of Leroy Hill's "Boz" shirt, brought to us by Eric Williams of the Tacoma News-Tribune in his game recap:

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Star-divide

The Bad:

I am going to keep this section brief if only to enjoy this win a little bit on a Monday morning, but there were definitely some worrisome aspects. First and foremost was the offensive output against a less than elite defense. The Seahawks O never really got running on all cylinders and started off extremely slowly. They got things going eventually and made enough plays to win the game, but Tarvaris Jackson was mediocre and the rushing attack wasn't as potent as you'd like to see.

Also, the kick/punt returns of late have me a little worried, as do just the overall performance of special teams. Leon Washington has had issues gaining anything big in the return game, ran backwards on one occasion, losing precious yardage, and muffed a punt that could have been brutal and changed the course of the game had Byron Maxwell not recovered it. I know that Leon is one of the best in the business but Sunday wasn't his, or the special teams kick units', best game. As Nick pointed out, I would be remiss to mention that Leon did almost return one to the house (he had just the punter to beat) so it's not like he played awful, it's just something to improve on.

On offense, the Seahawks are still not using all their weapons. They had only one target to their tight ends, a ten yard pass to Zach Miller. That's just not enough and I feel like Darrell Bevell should work to include them significantly more despite the big losses on the offensive line. 

Speaking of the offensive line, replacement right guard Paul McQuistan, by my estimation, had a rough day, if not only for the repeated penalties he incurred in key spots. Two false starts and a hold went against McQuistan and it will be interesting to see if the Seahawks do anything about this - they've got a capable Lemuel Jeanpierre waiting in the wings and I've heard good things about UDFA rookie Jerriel King as well. Also, with James Carpenter yet to go on the IR, another roster spot is about to open up. I'm not advocating the benching of McQuistan at all - it's a tough, tough spot to be in for him, but at what point do the Seahawks start sitting down repeat penalty offenders?

The Ugly

Speaking of those penalties - seriously, what the hell? 13 more for 100 yards lost. It's just annoying. 

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I sure hope Spags doesn't get fired.

To have the kind of injuries they’ve had — AGAIN — on a still-young team, I dunno what the expectations are, I know they haven’t been winners in a long, long time, but I would hope they don’t toss him because this season crapped the bed. I like him and think he’s a good coach.

At least they might let him use Josh McDaniels as a meat shield, if they’re smart. It’s fairly common to sacrifice an assistant coach or three to buy one extra year for the head coach. They had to bring in a new coordinator, and of course he was on the top of the list, it made sense at the time but by the looks of the sidelines he’s a big part of the problem and not the solution.

Of course as a Seahawk fan there’s always the schadenfreude that would come from the Rams thinking they got a hot HC candidate waiting in the wings. One more year, one more proud Western franchise laid absolute waste.

Head of catering.

by jacobstevens on Nov 21, 2011 7:52 AM PST reply actions  

Nah.

PC is our defensive guy. I think you’d get more clash-of-personalities between Carroll and Spagnuolo.

by robbbbbb on Nov 21, 2011 8:36 AM PST up reply actions  

I don't think that's necessarily true.

Carroll’s a defensive guy, yes, but he’s shown that he really respects his staff and doesn’t really force them to change their system. Except for the addition of the Leo spot, this defense didn’t really change a whole lot between 2009 and 2010.

by Coach Owens on Nov 21, 2011 8:56 AM PST up reply actions   1 recs

There's a big difference between our 2009 and our 2011

The smaller difference between 2009 and 2010 was due to the impossibility of completely overhauling a roster in 1 year.

by Greetings from the Lord Humongous! on Nov 21, 2011 9:40 AM PST up reply actions  

Big difference

Our defense appears almost ready to be an elite championship calliber D. We just need the O to go with it. The Hawks defense plays with a swagger, just like you said, and a mean demeaner. I really like it. I was getting bored of being a “finesse” team.

by datboyeddiep on Nov 21, 2011 10:59 AM PST up reply actions  

He gives his assistants a lot autonomy and control

within his system & philosophy. He won’t hire them if they don’t fit into his system & philosophy.

Head of catering.

by jacobstevens on Nov 21, 2011 12:26 PM PST up reply actions  

The only reasons to fire a coach in my opinion...

Is if his team stops playing hard for him or it’s realized that he wasn’t ready and is out of his depth, and I don’t see that in St. Louis. Of course, many owners are stupid about such matters, so… what the hell do I know…

Most of my cliches aren't original.

- Chuck Knox

by Azimeir on Nov 21, 2011 9:43 AM PST up reply actions  

I was just looking at the remaining schedule for the Seahawks.

Given that jay Cutler will miss 6 to 8 weeks with a broken thumb on his throwing hand, I now suggest that it is almost likely that Seattle will either win out or lose only one remaining (9ers) game this year. Playoffs, likely not but 10-6, 9-7? This is a strong possibility.

by Michael Harp on Nov 21, 2011 7:56 AM PST reply actions   1 recs

If they play like they did yesterday (offensively), I would disagree mightily.

Tarvaris needs to play much, much better than he did. We were simply lucky we drew a completely dreadful team yesterday.

Against teams like WAS, PHI, SF and even a Culter-less CHI, we’ll need to move the ball offensively much, much better to win against those teams.

Always up for some Twitter action @nandron. I only talk NW sports, though.

by Nick Andron on Nov 21, 2011 8:07 AM PST up reply actions  

If it wasn't for the CW debacle in Cleveland, we would have a legit shot at 9 wins

Right now, it looks like the hawks could go 4-2 and be 8-8, which I think is an appropriate grade for the team.

by goatweed on Nov 21, 2011 8:36 AM PST up reply actions  

Yeah the good pass rushing teams should continue to give us trouble.

The Rams still have good pass rushers. Washington, look out.

I dunno what this team will be able to do to improve that right side. Maybe nothing. I dunno if I’m a fool for thinking about how many wins this team can get if the right side will doom them in the playoffs anyway. But every game is winnable, I’ll say that much.

But we could implode against Washington. It could happen.

Head of catering.

by jacobstevens on Nov 21, 2011 8:40 AM PST up reply actions  

Back to back wins makes it pretttttyyyyy easy to forget The Ohio Games and The Steelers Game, huh?

But you’re right, there’s no reason to feel confident that those Seahawks won’t show up.

by jhmg16 on Nov 21, 2011 8:50 AM PST up reply actions  

Didn't forget those games

Our offense needs a QB. T Jax isn’t doing bad but he isn’t good enough for us to be elite. We are a up and coming team and I think we are better than we were last season. If we had Matt and a healthy front on offense, we could be good. That’s if Matt could stay healthy.

by datboyeddiep on Nov 21, 2011 11:02 AM PST up reply actions  

Matthew got sacked just reading that post.

Teams (for foreign blogs): Seahawks, Mariners, Huskies and Broncos. Yes, I recognize the contradiction; I was born in Denver.

by THolt on Nov 21, 2011 2:19 PM PST via iPhone app up reply actions   1 recs

I think the major differences in the Ohio games and now is the dedication to the run.

Our flat out abandonment of the run against Cleveland( exceptional pass defense, terrible run defense.) Cost us that game, period.
Look at Time of Possesion for the Steelers game, 39 mins to 21 mins, Cleveland 43 to 17.

Look at our last two wins. 35-25 10 mins more offense both games

We ran the ball against dallas, but they did the same back so we were almost even there. There are four very good reasons to run the ball. One, Offensive balance is harder to stop. Two, Giving your defense a chance to rest, Three, Running takes less energy from offensive lineman, and more energy from defensive linemen. Four, chewing up the clock late in thegame to hold the lead.

Clock management is a big part of running the ball too, unless the runner goes out of bounds it keeps the clock running, unlike incomplete passes, and often complete passes on the sideline where the reciever goes out of bounds. Its an equalizer, if used properly, to reduce your opponents opportunities.

In both of those games we lost we had no clock management.

by Oliudyen on Nov 21, 2011 1:00 PM PST up reply actions   1 recs

Also, no one mentions...

…but Lynch also got scratched from the lineup – at game time no less – in the Cleveland game, which probably flushed two weeks of gameplanning.

Most of my cliches aren't original.

- Chuck Knox

by Azimeir on Nov 21, 2011 3:15 PM PST up reply actions  

I really hope not considering the Redskins game will be my first NFL game...

I’d really like to see us win.

Eternally looking forward to someone making a Seahawks song based off of Lil' Jon's "Shots" song named "Hawks!"

by Bobby Cink on Nov 21, 2011 8:50 AM PST up reply actions  

Wow. I had no idea.

Washington is in a 3-way tie for 1st in sacks – 31 on the season.

/gulp

Always up for some Twitter action @nandron. I only talk NW sports, though.

by Nick Andron on Nov 21, 2011 11:01 AM PST up reply actions  

7 picks on the year.

They haven’t been ball-hawking much this season.

Always up for some Twitter action @nandron. I only talk NW sports, though.

by Nick Andron on Nov 21, 2011 11:17 AM PST up reply actions  

Oh. I'm just basing this on reputation alone.

At the very least, Hall and Wilson have shown the ability, in the past, to take advantage of bad throws by QBs, though it may be interesting to see if we can’t take advantage of the size mistmatch.

by Greetings from the Lord Humongous! on Nov 21, 2011 11:22 AM PST up reply actions  

I'm not sure I'd put Wilson in that category... regardless, Hall isn't exactly doing well right now either.

Here are some juicy quotes he gave after Sunday’s loss to the Cowboys:

"The way I’m playing right now, they need to go cut me because I’m definitely not worth what I’m getting. It’s frustrating…I would cut myself if I was in the front office."

I guess either he’ll have a chip on his shoulder (bad) or suck a lot (good!).

by HititHere on Nov 21, 2011 12:10 PM PST up reply actions  

Your words are hurtful, jacob.

blah blah blah pancake social blah blah blah

"The time has come," the Walrus said, "to talk of many things."

by shams on Nov 21, 2011 1:05 PM PST up reply actions  

I felt like penalties were not as bad this game.

There were a couple deliberate Delay-of-Game penalties. The new guys on the O-line get a pass this game IMO. And then there were penalties that stacked on top of each other (there was that sequence on third down and short where they backed up 20 yards or so) where it would have been an unlikely conversion even after the first penalty.

Gallery got busted a couple of times, though – not good.

Overall, I thought the team discipline was much better.

by Groundhog on Nov 21, 2011 7:58 AM PST reply actions  

A few comments from me:

I’m a little perplexed by the dig on Leon. Guy had two excellent punt returns (in addition to the muffed punt). I think he’s fine.

Anthony McCoy looked to have his best game as a pro, in my opinion. On multiple occasions I saw him block Jake Long himself. That’s impressive.

Kam is quickly cementing himself as a player to be feared. Guy just clocks people. I love it.

Jon Ryan punted out of his mind. That guy is worth every penny he’s being paid.

I really like that despite a somewhat ugly performance by the offense, we still put up 24 points and came out with a solid victory.

The Seahawks are terrible at disguised runs (pass formation) with Forsett and Washington. Just awful.

That’s about it for now =)

Always up for some Twitter action @nandron. I only talk NW sports, though.

by Nick Andron on Nov 21, 2011 8:05 AM PST reply actions  

Chris Long

Jake Long is LT for the Fins, no relation as far as I know.

by Stay Off the Flowers on Nov 21, 2011 8:08 AM PST up reply actions  

Whoops. Chris Long.

Always up for some Twitter action @nandron. I only talk NW sports, though.

by Nick Andron on Nov 21, 2011 8:18 AM PST up reply actions  

Yeah yeah, Chris Long

I loved how on Marshawn’s TD run Dan Dierdorf immediately tried to call holding on Long by McCoy. Then the replay showed McCoy’s hands clearly inside Long’s shoulder pads, and Dierdorf had to eat crow.

by 12thman on Nov 21, 2011 8:19 AM PST up reply actions  

The Seahawks just scored a touchdown, they must have cheated!!

Eternally looking forward to someone making a Seahawks song based off of Lil' Jon's "Shots" song named "Hawks!"

by Bobby Cink on Nov 21, 2011 8:37 AM PST up reply actions   2 recs

Actually, it was Tim Ryan (Dierdorf works for CBS)

But yeah, I enjoyed that too

I'd rather know a little about a lot than a lot about a little

by Sportszilla on Nov 21, 2011 8:38 AM PST up reply actions  

Ah, right

I keep thinking back to Baltimore last week.

by 12thman on Nov 21, 2011 10:34 AM PST up reply actions  

Dierdorf did

I was saying that he is just protecting Howie’s boy, it was a Fox broadcast. I was wondering if Howie and Dan had a history somehow. He was being very protective…

by datboyeddiep on Nov 21, 2011 11:05 AM PST up reply actions  

Whoever it was

I remember him speaking up for Howie’s boy…

by datboyeddiep on Nov 21, 2011 11:05 AM PST up reply actions  

They were drafted back to back as the first and second overall picks

That is the extent of their relationship

Stats are not a euphemism for tits.

by Trenchtown on Nov 21, 2011 12:38 PM PST up reply actions  

The TJax hitch is back, he is just not as confident anymore

Perhaps this is the result of the return from injury and trying to find his rhythm again but he looks awful in quick pass situations. His chemistry with BMW is terrible, who is supposed to be his possession receiver. Miller, just doesn’t release to the middle as much, maybe they are keeping him out of the routes where he could get popped again.

They are all excuses, he should have been able to shred a defense which has guys off the street at the corners (street corners).

by goatweed on Nov 21, 2011 8:24 AM PST up reply actions  

Wow.

I rarely log in mobile, as I find the typing tedious, but I just have to say this is the WEIRDEST imagery I think I’ve ever heard.

Did you just come up with that, or have you been saving it? Seriously, I really want to know! :)

"Now I'm tired of this s---. I'm sick and f------ tired of an 8-10 record. I'm f------ tired of losing to Purdue. I'm not here to f--- around this week. Now you may be, but I'm not." -- Bobby Knight, circa 1992

by Tyler Jorgensen on Nov 21, 2011 9:59 AM PST via mobile up reply actions  

I wouldn't say that he had his best game.

Which is what I did say. Wasn’t really meant to be a dig, just something that I didn’t like about this particular game. I’m with you that he’s fine – and I’m not worried about him so much as just the special teams play on a whole.
I could never take a dig at LEON!!! I love that guy!

by Danny Kelly on Nov 21, 2011 8:34 AM PST up reply actions  

24 points is more than 22 points, but 1 > 3.

It certainly makes a big difference when you can relegate your damn kicker to one-point 19-yard kicks as opposed to 3-point 19-yard kicks (blech).

Most of my cliches aren't original.

- Chuck Knox

by Azimeir on Nov 21, 2011 3:20 PM PST up reply actions  

The Rams were so terrible yesterday that I'm sort of inclined to disagree with everything mentioned about our defense in The Good.

And the Rams aren’t just bad, they are devastated by injuries. Like, worse than us, by a lot.

but there’s one pattern that’s emerging for Seattle, and that is – if Chris Clemons plays out of his mind, the defense dominates.

This just seems a bit flimsy to me. There isn’t much evidence for the cause-and-effect thing mentioned, and I’d actually argue that when our corners are shutting down their woeful, woeful receiving corps (and damn, gameball goes to Sherman and Browner for that performance in my opinion) then it gives Clemons the extra 2-3 seconds he has needed to reach the passer this season. Clemons’ motor has been awesome though.

by jhmg16 on Nov 21, 2011 8:37 AM PST reply actions  

The run D is still solid

Mebane and Bryant were pretty disruptive. I agree it’s hard to grade the defense based on the opponent they faced this weekend. At least they are taking care of an opponent they should beat.

by goatweed on Nov 21, 2011 8:43 AM PST up reply actions  

Our run defense is good. Doesn't matter how good or bad our opponent...

…so long as the feature back is a one-cut power guy like Jackson, and not a DeMarco Murray. Happily, most backs we face over the course of the season are in the mold of the former.

by jhmg16 on Nov 21, 2011 8:48 AM PST up reply actions  

Also bear in mind...

…that Jackson’s 15-42 line was padded with a 19-yard scamper on 3rd and 25ish from the Rams own 5 with the ‘Hawks in prevent defense, or what Football Outsiders would label as a negative play for the purposes of their calculations. So 14 carries for 23 yards for Steven Jackson, and that’s good on any day.

Most of my cliches aren't original.

- Chuck Knox

by Azimeir on Nov 21, 2011 10:03 AM PST up reply actions   1 recs

Doesn't matter

Our run defense is one of the best in the league. Feel free to correct me if I’m wrong but don’t we lead the league in YPC. We have an elite run defense and that was against one of the best RB’s in the league. Also Baltimore iddn’t do anything with Ray Rice.

by datboyeddiep on Nov 21, 2011 11:08 AM PST up reply actions  

1st in the NFC, 3rd in the NFL through 10 games in YPC (3.5):

8th in yards per game (100)
Faced 10th most rush attempts per game (28.6)
Tied for 3rd fewest running TDs (5, none since Oct 2)
Longest run allowed 32 yards (6th best in league)

Stats here.

by Greetings from the Lord Humongous! on Nov 21, 2011 11:20 AM PST up reply actions   2 recs

Hawks are the tits!

Most of my cliches aren't original.

- Chuck Knox

by Azimeir on Nov 21, 2011 3:23 PM PST up reply actions  

I changed it to "I feel" so as to not speak in absolutes so much, because you've got a good point.

It’s pretty tough to cite stats to back up a cause and effect theory (chicken or the egg type of thing) but my thought is that when Clemons is playing his best he’s a total game-changer. You’re right though that it’s a flimsy statement (flaccid, even?) when it comes to data and stats that back it up, which I didn’t include or look up at this time, but that was just my thought.

As for the fact the Rams are terrible: Yeah, you’re right. The Seahawks still beat them though. What specifically about the Good section would you disagree about? At some point I just like to take what I can get in terms of one side of the ball doing what they’re supposed to do, regardless of the opposition, and I am careful not to anoint them as perfect or anything.

I agree that Sherman and Browner had great games but you also prefaced that with two ‘woefuls’ to describe who they were guarding so, you are pretty much doing what you were disagreeing with me for doing : )

by Danny Kelly on Nov 21, 2011 8:50 AM PST up reply actions  

I feel like you just Inception'd me into doing that. Me doing that was your bad bro.

I was just trying to cram too much information into one sentence. I’m horrible about using parenthetical asides because I’m really bad about overusing commas, which is actually a worse habit than just overusing commas.

ANYWAY they were two separate thoughts. After Brandon Lloyd that corps is a w f u l. Lloyd is awesome and it makes me sad that he’s been banished to St. Louis. But I’m giving props to Browner and Sherman for making multiple really nice plays on the ball, which is another one of those things on my List Of Things The Seahawks Were Usually Terrible At, Man It’s Refreshing To Now See These Things.

I don’t disagree with anything specifically which is why I worded my post the way I did. That game just felt like such a pillow fight that it’s kind of risky to be too complimentary of anything we did on defense. But I’m also not arguing that the resulting play was not good- it was- so I’m not sure what I’m arguing or where I am right now.

by jhmg16 on Nov 21, 2011 9:15 AM PST up reply actions  

You should do a weekly LOTTSWUTAMIRTNSTT.

hahaha – I am with you though, and know what you’re saying. The game was more or less dominated by the Seahawks but I didn’t really ever feel that excited about it throughout. Going back though, looking at what the defense did to the Rams, awful as they may be, was nice. Which we agree on, so, I think … hey! let’s ride bikes!

by Danny Kelly on Nov 21, 2011 9:23 AM PST up reply actions  

It's a correlation and you didn't state otherwise

When Clemons goes off, we’re getting to the QB and the QB is likely going to have a bad day. It’s true for many teams that their defense will succeed if their premier pass-rusher is having a good day.

by Greetings from the Lord Humongous! on Nov 21, 2011 9:45 AM PST up reply actions   1 recs

Flip that around and when you are winning and ahead, your pass rusher generally has a good day.

Its called teeing off, pinning your ears back, setting the rabbit, earning big pay checks.
Mathis and Freeney are good, but always being ahead made them much better.
I just wish we could find not only clemons replacement for the future but his side kick for the now!
Raheem has been a disappointment so far, infact I see Red in there a lot more often on passing situations.

by Oliudyen on Nov 21, 2011 1:13 PM PST up reply actions  

True

Clemons has been relatively successful despite playing on a team that has struggled (for long periods) to put up points.

by Greetings from the Lord Humongous! on Nov 21, 2011 1:17 PM PST up reply actions  

I'm impressed with Jackson

I mean what did you expect? I think he has been a good “patch” QB. We didn’t sell the whole franchise for him like the Cards did for Kolb, I think it was a great decision. Although I would have loved to get Andy Dalton and use our first rounder on something else this year…..

by datboyeddiep on Nov 21, 2011 11:11 AM PST up reply actions  

Unlike many, I felt, like Pete felt, that Whitehurst's performance wasn't that great.

I went back and watched it and even where he succeeded, he should have probably done even better. Given how Jackson played before, during and after I feel confident we would have won yet had Jackson not been injured.

Head of catering.

by jacobstevens on Nov 21, 2011 12:31 PM PST up reply actions  

I think its clear that Whitehurst even when playing well, has played himself out of the NFL in 2012

Jackson on the other hand, while playing hurt, has been up and down.
Crazy enough he is just about on par with hasslebeck the last three years. Only Jackson has some potential upswing. He is more mobile, has a stronger arm, and is way younger.

I’d Love to get RG3 this year, maybe even (sacraligious words forth coming) more than Luck. Luck may be the next Peyton Manning, RG3 May be the next Drew Brees.
Anyhow enough tangents.

I Want TJ to throw less INT and more TD, id be fine with his completion percentage and his YPA if he did that.

by Oliudyen on Nov 21, 2011 1:21 PM PST up reply actions  

Luck is not the next Peyton Manning

I actually think he may flop as a QB. Peyton Manning was the entire Tennessee offense in college, just like he became with the Colts. Stanford, on the other hand, rely heavily on a great run game and tough defense. Just like the 49ers. Luck may just as well be the next Alex Smith.

by B.B.Finnegan on Nov 21, 2011 1:57 PM PST up reply actions  

Peyton Manning played with Jamal Lewis, Chad Clifton and Peerless Price.

He was hardly the entire offense. They also had Al Wilson, Leonard Little, Shaun Ellis and Deon Grant on defense, so he benefited from that as well.

by Nate Dogg on Nov 21, 2011 3:04 PM PST up reply actions   1 recs

Then here are a couple to help him out

Stanford runs 53 percent of the time.
Luck has the fewest sacks of any QB in college football.
When Luck is hit and sacked or depended on to bring the team from behind he looks rushed and unsure. He is a great QB when they are shoving the ball up the other teams gut. TJ looks decent when we have a dominant defense and solid run game.
Luck will struggle if he starts right away for any team that can draft him first. The question is can he learn to produce under pressure. He has never had to on a consistent basis, so we will have to wait and see.

they took turns pissing into the bitch's ocular cavities.
This way to the cafeteria!

by stufr on Nov 21, 2011 4:01 PM PST up reply actions  

According to ESPN Barkley has been sacked 7 times, Luck 9.

TCU ran 65% of the time last year with Dalton, UW ran 57% of the time with Locker last year. Cal ran 61% of the time when Aaron Rodgers was a senior.

Luck also plays with 4 tight ends and basically no receivers, making orchestrating come backs much more difficult.

by Nate Dogg on Nov 21, 2011 4:21 PM PST up reply actions  

Exactly and look at how much better Barkley's numbers are this year compared to last

Luck only took 6 sacks last year, so this year the drop off in protection hasn’t killed him. I’m not saying he is bad or not worth the top pick or so. I’m just saying that he isn’t a sure thing. He will face more demands and more pressure and that effects guys different. Anybody who tells you that he is a sure thing is just plain wrong.

they took turns pissing into the bitch's ocular cavities.
This way to the cafeteria!

by stufr on Nov 21, 2011 4:39 PM PST up reply actions  

Luck is not our guy

I don’t think so anyway. I’ve never been impressed with Luck. He only throws to 6’6" and 6’8" tight ends, rarely gets the ball to receivers. I like Barkley better than him. I don’t even want Barkley though, who I want was stated in a post by Oliudyen, RG3. Robert Griffen the third is a gold mine. He is the fastest player in college football, he has a strong arm, and even though he is fast he is a pocket QB first. I watched this guy play in hgih school in Copperas Cove, Tx (I’m from Ft Hood/Killeen which is right by it) and seen him in college. Guy has progressed so much and he is awesome. He is the best QB in the draft and it isn’t even close!

by datboyeddiep on Nov 22, 2011 4:05 AM PST up reply actions  

I wonder if the Rams being bad in the secondary, but still having a good D line and us basically down to 3rd string on the right side kind of cancel each other out

I actually expected TJax to shred the Rams with his arm because they’re so thin in the secondary right now. I was a little disappointed with his performance, but it sure seemed like that pressure was on him most of the day.

Defense kept their foot on the pedal all day though. If not for Sherman getting deked by Lloyd’s great recovery on the TD, it could’ve been a shutout.

by Kingdomer on Nov 21, 2011 9:44 AM PST reply actions  

If one were to point out the most glaring weakness of Tavaris Jackson's game...

…(and people on this site have many times) it would be his overall pocket presence, his ability (or lack thereof) to adapt to a shifting/collapsing pocket. At one point the Rams had four sacks and I felt three of them were sacks that T-Jack had the athletic ability to avoid with slightly accelerated processing speed or just plain assertiveness. The most frustrating one would’ve been the 3rd and 24 when he took a sack at about the ‘Hawks 40 rather than take a chance downfield in the best situation to take a chance. Some of it’s just poor football acumen.

The Rams bloggers on this site made a note that their defensive ends were still very much getting it done and that their expert play had really masked a lot of their DB issues; watching the Rams play yesterday, I would definitely concur. Still, I though Jackson made good decisions when he did throw (for the most part) and good throws.

Most of my cliches aren't original.

- Chuck Knox

by Azimeir on Nov 21, 2011 9:56 AM PST up reply actions  

I agree

Great post. Jackson is not the greatest QB, but he is getting the job done…..

by datboyeddiep on Nov 21, 2011 11:13 AM PST up reply actions  

Very well said, and I agree

We’ve seen Jackson bring the vertical passing attack a few times in this stretch, and with the Rams so thin in coverage, I just expected more.

In fact, I’d say it was an oddly ineffective performance given how well he’s played lately, the blame for which my gut tells me to leave somewhat at the feet of the O-Line, but yeah, he frequently doesn’t “help” his line with his pocket presence.

by Kingdomer on Nov 21, 2011 11:31 AM PST up reply actions  

I wonder.

“The most frustrating one would’ve been the 3rd and 24 when he took a sack at about the ‘Hawks 40 rather than take a chance downfield in the best situation to take a chance. Some of it’s just poor football acumen.”
If this isnt exactly when he was trying to do on several throws that ended quite badly.
I agree he is about a second or two slow getting the ball out sometimes. I cant tell if he is just trying to stay in the pocket and make a safe play, if he is told to take the sack over the INT?
The big two glaring weakensses I see are the INTs and lack of TDs. I’d rather just punt than throw an INT. You gotta play Defense either way, you just have a lot more control with punting.

by Oliudyen on Nov 21, 2011 1:27 PM PST up reply actions  

What has TJ been told to do?

This is the great mystery, isn’t it? His stats and play would make one think that he’s been told no to take big chances, but given Pete’s style and our gigantic WRs (Williams and Rice anyway), maybe that’s not the case. I dunno.

I also can’t see the whole field watching from home, so I have no idea what Jackson saw down field on the 3rd and 24 sack. He kept teasing a throw with little baby pumps like he was Gold Leader in Star Wars running the trench “ALMOST THERE! ALMOST THERE!” and then Darth Vader creamed his ass. It seems T-Jack is unwilling to use the force. =s

However, later, he threw a pretty pass right into Mike’s bread basket in the back of the end zone that Williams failed to pull in.

I just dunno.

Most of my cliches aren't original.

- Chuck Knox

by Azimeir on Nov 21, 2011 3:37 PM PST up reply actions  

You do realize just HOW INJURED TJack is right now, don't you?

He only practiced one day all week before the game. I wasn’t surprised he was off to start the game, he only threw the ball at ALL on Thursday last week, and even then, Charlie got 50% of the 1st team snaps. Charlie took all the 1st team snaps in all other practices, as TJack didn’t practice at all the other days.

Between games, he has to ice, rest, and receive medical care for the pec injury. He doesn’t get to practice much at all, so I’m actually surprised he’s doing as well as he is (mediocre). It’s pretty condeming to Charlie the Unicorn that TJ continues to get the nod at QB when he can barely practice all week.

by BlueThruAndThru on Nov 21, 2011 11:08 PM PST up reply actions  

I want to see that play again,

Because when i saw it live, it really seemed that Kam was playing deep half and broke his zone to cover the inside receiver.
Sherman looked to be playing trail on the play. Either way it was broken coverage.

by Oliudyen on Nov 21, 2011 1:23 PM PST up reply actions  

Even more impressive about shutting down Stephen Jackson

Most of his yards came on that 19 yard run on 3rd and 25. Take that away and he averaged 1.6 yards a carry

by B.B.Finnegan on Nov 21, 2011 1:58 PM PST reply actions  

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