Positional Value in the NFL Draft
On the heels of my Corey Liuget to the Hawks post, I wanted to both defend my pick regarding the positional importance to the Seahawks, and also point out why it probably won't happen the way I hope.
I came across an article this morning that talks about the changing landscape regarding the value of certain positions in the NFL draft and wanted to point it out to you. The conventional wisdom of drafting would rate quarterbacks, offensive tackles, and speed defensive ends as the most valuable commodities in the field of positions. While that still may be true, interior offensive linemen and defensive tackles are making a push to be included on that list as well. The reason cited in this article by Dan Pompei for the National Football Post is that offenses are changing.
NFL offenses are eschewing the conventional deep drop backs for short dropbacks and quick throws. This puts more value on the interior 3-tech pass rushing position and less so on the outside edge rushing defensive ends. Also, because these players are becoming more important, so are the interior linemen designated to stop their rush.
As Pompei puts it in his article:
If a defensive tackle can penetrate, either through power or quickness, he can force a quarterback to adjust even on a well executed short drop that's intended to yield a quick pass. "Because the ball comes out so quickly so you have to be able to push into the quarterback, take away his ability to step up and force him to stay deeper in the pocket," said one head coach who is considering taking a defensive tackle very high in the draft. "So an explosive pass rusher, whether it's a three technique or nose, who can give you inside push has become more important."
We've seen the impact that Ndamukong Suh and Gerald McCoy have had on their teams in year one and teams aren't ignoring that fact. Defensive Tackle is one of the deepest spots in the draft this year, but Marcell Dareus and Nick Fairley are not expected to get out of the top 10 (or even top 5). This is another reason Corey Liuget (to my despair) is moving up boards as well. Conversely, it's also why guards like Mike Pouncey, Rodney Hudson, and Danny Watkins (as well as Will Rackley and Ben Ijalana) are moving up so high as well.
When we talk about the prospect of choosing a guard or defensive tackle with our first pick in the draft this is what may be on John Schneider and Pete Carroll's minds. Conventional wisdom would dictate that you take guards later in the draft but that wisdom might be changing. Recently, Warren Moon and Ray Roberts mentioned on Brock and Salk that they'd take an interior offensive lineman or defensive lineman with #25 over any of the QB prospects and any other position (it's a pretty funny clip, check it out). These guys both played the game for a long time so I take their opinions seriously. It's something to keep in mind as we get closer and closer to day one.
So will Liuget fall to #25? Maybe, but the more I think on it, not likely. Phil Taylor, Muhammad Wilkerson, and perhaps a dark horse a la Tyson Alualu will all be taken before him and he'll make it to #25. If he does, I'd say grab him in a heartbeat. But if he doesn't, does that mean that we want to look at the number of really talented guards or tackles that are still available? Do we go with a guy like Muhammad Wilkerson to bolster depth at the 5-tech and hope he can play 3-tech? This is why being the GM is such a difficult job.
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I've thought for at least a year now that A & B gap pressure is underrated.
Anyone who agrees with the sentiment of this post change their thinking on Brandon Mebane? There were more than a handful who would have preferred to pay the man $12m to buy time to sign him to a long-term deal. But closing speed is his biggest weakness.
Head of catering.
Closing speed isn't the issue, it's getting past the line and getting ANY kind of pressure.
At least, in my opinion. It’s pretty rare for a DT to get a sack by way of simply beating their blocker… but we’ve seen over and over when a DT gets just enough pressure to knock down a pass, force a bad pass, or flush the QB from the pocket.
Mebane doesn’t get a lot of sacks, no. But he does beat his man quite regularly, and combine this with his ability to bust up running plays (especially short-yardage) and I think it would be absolutely stupid to let him go.
I recognize what he can do.
I’m saying, closing speed is the issue, because what he accomplishes in his under tackle role against his lineman counterpart often ends up irrelevant because the QB isn’t pressured. If people are viewing pressure up front as becoming more important, that would figure to make Mebane less valuable.
Head of catering.
by jacobstevens on Apr 11, 2011 12:12 PM PDT up reply actions
I guess I'm misunderstanding what you mean by closing speed.
Maybe I’m just putting myself in the position of the quarterback. Considering it’s only maybe five yards from me to this big, tankish DT, the very fact that he’s beaten his man would probably be sufficient to get me off my throwing game.
Then again, I’m not an NFL quarterback.
Perhaps, with the modern-day emphasis on the passing game, we’ll be seeing smaller, faster DT’s. Is this the case already? I think back to when I coached 11-13 year olds, and was shocked to see opposing defences line up some of their smallest kids at DT. It seemed stupid until those smallest kids pretty much walked around my big, beefy, slow guards and flung themselves into the backfield. They were never able to tackle my backs or quarterbacks, but they sure got in the way.
just injecting some stats here
Mebane – while at the NT or 1-tech style position in 2008 had 5.5 sacks and 18 QB hurries – in 2009 he was moved to the 3-tech and only had 1.5 sacks and then in 2010 1 sack. I’m not sure why this production has gone down, could be any number of reasons, but it seems like he may be more suited to the 1-tech spot.
I personally am not making the argument to let him walk – I hope they resign him. But it seems like you’d like to get more than 2.5 sacks from your “premier pass rushing player” in two years.
Here’s an interesting article from before 2009 about his move to the 3-tech – its a good read anyway:
http://seahawknationblog.com/2009/06/the-more-the-seahawks’-coaches-see-of-brandon-mebane-the-more-they-like-him/
What do you think of leaving him as our starting under-tackle and then rotating him to 1-tech on passing downs?
by Hawkhammer19 on Apr 11, 2011 2:17 PM PDT up reply actions
Maybe it's because Colin Cole just doesn't command double teams the way the Brandon Mebane/Rocky Bernard line did in 2008.
Of course there are numerous other factors to consider here.
I see that. I like the idea of moving him back.
But honestly, I don’t care how many sacks he gets, as long as he’s getting pressures. I think sacks are quite frequently a random stat for DT’s… not many DT’s get a lot of sacks, and the difference between a two-sack “mediocre” player and a six-sack “Pro Bowl” player is often just a couple of QB’s tripping.
do you guys know a place that tracks QB hurries?
I tried FO but couldn’t find a real number. that might help with this discussion
FO does track it but it usually comes out pretty late in the offseason
and with the exception of the post they’ll put up about best and worst pass rushers I think it all goes behind their pay wall and into their almanac.
not exactly what youre looking for...
http://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2011/03/16/pass-rushing-productivity-3/
it only lists the top 10, and bases it on qb hits, hurries, and sacks.
lists players based on how often they attempt to rush the qb and how often they are succsesful.
it also has brandon mebane ranked for third
for productictivity per rush attempt for interior defensive linemen
Wilkerson intrigues me because we need more depth at 5-tech and more pass rush at 3-tech
and Wilk could potentially offer a boost in both respects.
I haven't really considered Phil Taylor
but perhaps we take him at 25 for our NT of the future?
Also, I have never played football myself, so I don’t know the difference between 1, 2, and 3 techniques for defensive linemen. Could someone do a post on these? Better yet, could someone do a post about the hybrid/LEO defense we employ and what makes it different/special from a traditional 3-4 and 4-3?
Check out this post for a good synopsis:
http://17power.blogspot.com/2011/02/player-types-seattle-will-be-looking-to.html
the “number” of the tech refers to where they line up in relation to the offensive line.
Here’s a extremely thick read on Pete Carrolls defense that you can find the info in – i’ll probably do a write up on this after the draft to lay it out in layman’s terms.
DTs are always highly sought after in the draft.
They’re usually one of the most drafted positions in the first round, regardless of the pundits’ player values. I don’t think Moon and Roberts way out of bounds.

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