The Next Seahawks QB...Vince Young?
by J.L. White on Jun 20, 2011 2:10 PM PDT
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Right now, there is very little talk on where Vince Young will end up (and right now, he's still on the Tennessee Titans roster). There is even less talk -- or maybe none at all -- of Young coming to the Seattle Seahawks. But if you consider all the quarterbacks that are likely to be available through trades or free agency, once the lockout is lifted, Young might be the smartest bet this team could make.
Right now Charlie Whitehurst is the only quarterback on the Seahawks roster and I'm neither displeased or overjoyed with that; it's a absolute fact that we will acquire 1 or 2 (or even 3) more QBs once the front office is allowed to do so. The most likely scenario is that we re-sign the soon-to-be-36-year-old Matt Hasselbeck, a quarterback who has noticeably and precipitously declined over the past 3 seasons. The Seahawks offered him $7 million to stay before the lockout began, so that shows the team is at least somewhat eager to retain his services. But if not Matt, who? Carson Palmer seems to be the best choice to take over, but Mike Brown has has said multiple times that no such trade will be made; it appears it will take a 1st round pick to acquire Kevin Kolb, and while Kyle Orton might come at a cheaper price, the Broncos might refuse to give him up.
To avoid rampant speculation, let's say no other quarterbacks were available via trade (and let's say there is a near-zero chance that free agents Peyton Manning and Michael Vick leave their respective teams), who else is there? After reviewing a list of free agent QBs, the best options appear to be Matt Leinart, Tavaris Jackson and Matt Moore (and I personally like the idea of bringing in Drew Stanton, Bruce Gradkowski, Tyler Thigpen or Billy Volek in as a 3rd stringer). I'm not sure what Moore has proved, other than being a slightly better option than Jake Delhomme; let's say he's not a realistic option.
Arguments have already been made to bring in Tavaris Jackson and Matt Leinart, so instead of going over them again, let's compare some almost-incomparable statistics:
- Tavaris Jackson played in 21 games in 2007 & 2008, and combined he totaled 2,967 yards, 18 touchdowns, 14 interceptions and a 58.5 completion percentage (as well as 337 yards rushing and 4 TDs).
- Matt Leinart played in 12 games in 2006, 5 games in 2007 and 4 games in 2008 (when Kurt Warner finally took over the starting gig for good); when you combine those 3 season you get 21 games, 3,458 yards, 13 touchdowns, 17 interceptions and a 55.8 completion percentage.
- As for the aforementioned Vince Young, he has played in 21 games in the last 2 seasons, finishing with 3,134 yards, 20 touchdowns, 10 interceptions and a 59.0 completion percentage (as well as 406 yards rushing, 2 TDs and a 5.0 rushing average).
I think that these stats show that Vince Young is already a superior QB than Jackson and Leinart, but truth be told that these stats were generated in 3 different offenses and in 3 different contexts, and don't actually prove a thing. In my opinion, Young's athletic abilities give him an upside of Michael Vick (oven higher), countered with numerous off-field incidents coupled with the "shoulder pads" incident that ot him benched last season and seemingly headed to the waiver wire this offseason. Is Young immature and beyond redemption, or perhaps did he chafe under the strict coaching of Jeff Fisher? Can a different coach and a different environment make a difference for the better?
It's those same negatives that might make him an affordable commodity to acquire, and why Seattle might be the best place for him to end up. There are plenty of avenues to success in the NFL, with finding an elite QB being the most successful. That's not the only way to win, though, and the recent success of Mike Williams may have shown us a way that no other team can utilize: acquire former college standouts (on the cheap) that have been disappointments in the pros so far, but still young enough to turn their careers around. I do believe Pete Carroll's success at USC was due in part in getting the most production out of "blue chip" recruits, and he still knows how to encourage those players whose best days were played on Saturdays. Most NFL coaches today are long-time assistants in the pros, and don't have that kind of experience.
The Seahawks had one of the worse offenses AND defenses in the league in 2010, yet were able to scrape together 7 wins and an improbable NFC West championship, and Carroll's coaching deserves much of the credit. While we continue to rebuild through the draft this team should exploit whatever avenues of talent they can find to improve this team today; Vince Young has the skills and abilities that I think Carroll really wants in his QB, and to bring him in and compete with Whitehurst for the starting job this year might be the smartest and most cost-effective transaction we can make.
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I would prefer Carson Palmer, but that's probably not going to happen.
BTW, I said the same thing about the Seahawks signing Michael Vick 2 years ago.
Jake Delhomme!!
I think we can build a better offense then the Jets, but no so sure about the defense.
Jake is done. Maybe more than Matt.
I hope you aren’t serious.
Until this lockout business ends, you'll see me as often on the links as you will on field gulls. Also-- everytime I swing the driver, I'll imagine Roger Goodell is the ball.
by Tyler Jorgensen on Jun 21, 2011 9:43 PM PDT up reply actions
He must be joking.
Delhome is Matt Lite.
Learn JiuJitsu.
While utilizing his face to absorb karate, Rashad Evans drunkenly explained to Lyoto that he hits like a little b**ch.
by RolloTomasi on Jun 22, 2011 10:34 AM PDT up reply actions
On the field, Vince Young is much better than any available available quarterback.
Based on traditional stuff like qb rating, completion %, yds/attempt, I think you’d have to say Young>Orton>Palmer>Jackson>Kolb>Leinart. Young also played in the general type of offense we’re trying to develop. He had a tough line and running game, a good blocking tight end in Craig Stevens and Bo Scaife… and he had some success. I think Vince Young makes a lot of sense.
I'm in the minority that would really like to see this happen
He’ll most likely come for free and has shown consistent (but admittedly marginal) improvement every season. I also think that if there’s one coach in the NFL that could bring the best out of him it’s PC. He needs constant motivation and a “buddy” type head coach. Fisher was never either of those things to him but he still played quite well. The big intangible is that the guy’s a winner. We can pick up a guy that’s gone to 2 pro bowls, won a national championship, won offensive rookie of the year, and turned an 0-6 team into a 9-7 finisher two years ago while not giving up draft picks. It’d certainly be exciting anyway!
Well said.
But my favorite part is that he would come with upside, but cheaply as well.
Until this lockout business ends, you'll see me as often on the links as you will on field gulls. Also-- everytime I swing the driver, I'll imagine Roger Goodell is the ball.
by Tyler Jorgensen on Jun 21, 2011 9:44 PM PDT up reply actions
Its not as bad an idea as some seem to think
Once the Titans release him (as is expected) taking a incentive laden flier on him would not be a bad move at all.
Beer, its not just for breakfast anymore.
If you do that then,,,
,,,,you can take a chance on Pryor w/ a 3rd if necessary.
,,,a need for speed>>>>
Absolutely not
TP is not only not a good QB, he’s an idiotic douche with an entitlement complex. I wouldn’t want to waste a 6th on Pryor.
by CMoney87 on Jun 20, 2011 7:42 PM PDT via mobile up reply actions
Not at all.
Seneca is short. Pryor is a legit TE/WR prospect in the mold that PC likes.
But he isn’t worth a third by any means.
Until this lockout business ends, you'll see me as often on the links as you will on field gulls. Also-- everytime I swing the driver, I'll imagine Roger Goodell is the ball.
by Tyler Jorgensen on Jun 21, 2011 9:46 PM PDT up reply actions
I'm putting my faith in Pete.
What ever he decides to do at Q.B. that’s the program I’m gettin’ behind.
At the end of the day, so will I.
Even if we bring back Matt we can hope to draft one of the top QBs next year (although I prefer to wait until after the season is over to speculate on stuff like that).
Bringing back Matt
only solidifies the Hawks make the Top 3 in the draft selection next year.
I agree PC is the type of coach that VY needs.
VY has all the physical tools, but often doesn’t know how to apply the correctly. In college, I think he was a lot like cam newton, his physical superiority on the field let him get away with not knowing or intuiting the right choice. In the NFL, he is still quite amazing physically, but there is so much less room for error. I also think he probably judges his mistakes fairly harshly; for example, taking his pads off is more likely to be related to his frustration and disappointment in himself than the way he was treated in Tennessee. I think he really does need a more nurturing situation where a coach serves more as a close friend and supportive mentor. A coach who when he blows a play or a game comes to him and says “its ok, thats what the defense was designed to do, now lets go to work to see how you can take advantage of it next time.” What the final product might be I think is still unknown, and maybe there is nothing beyond what we’ve already seen. Perhaps Coach Fisher had this approach with VY, and it failed… Hard to say what went on behind that teams closed doors. All said, if it is only a few $mil to get VY here, I say hell yeah, lets see what Tricky Pete and Bevell can do with him (even if it is cut him in 3 weeks because there is nothing to work with). Even if we bring VY in, I still think it’s better to have MH here as the starting QB this year (if you want the most wins possible).
On another note, why not give Matt Hasselback a 2 year contract for 12 million, 9 guaranteed, with a team option to convert it to a 1 year 6 million football contract and a 3 year player/QBs coach or assistant OC contract so you keep his experience in house to play QB if he’s still physically able, his know how and team spirit helping out on offensive coaching, and his mentoring of whatever players we acquire through FA and Draft.
Smashmouth is the new sexy!
Hmmm.
There have been player coaches, but it’s been a long time, and typically they were in basketball and baseball.
Until this lockout business ends, you'll see me as often on the links as you will on field gulls. Also-- everytime I swing the driver, I'll imagine Roger Goodell is the ball.
by Tyler Jorgensen on Jun 21, 2011 9:47 PM PDT up reply actions
Not mentally strong
I can’t see it. I don’t think there is room in Pete’s program for weak minded people. LenDale comes to mind as an example.
I can see Vince Young being brought in.
I can also see him getting cut two weeks later, like Lendale White. V. Young has a huge decision in front of him wherever he goes, I just hope he and his agent have a plan for his future, because he does have some skill. Hopefully he can find a spot where his skills are showcased, and not his shenanigans.
At least Pete is the type of coach to do that
It’s nice to trust him to bring in the best talent and jettison what doesn’t work with the team.
bdeviled11
Don’t believe all the negtive press.
http://burgundyblog.com/post/5367586151/vince
http://www.coldhardfootballfacts.com/Article.php?Page=3754
Great articles.
Thanks for bringing them to the table. I recommend everyone read them (and the comments in the burgundy blog) to get a deeper broader perspective.
Until this lockout business ends, you'll see me as often on the links as you will on field gulls. Also-- everytime I swing the driver, I'll imagine Roger Goodell is the ball.
by Tyler Jorgensen on Jun 21, 2011 10:10 PM PDT up reply actions
Tyler Thigpen
is an NFL starting QB, not a 3rd stringer. I have no doubts he would likely beat out Charlie if we brought him into camp. I had him on my fantasy team a few years ago and he lit it up every week (I think my original starter was Trent Edwards though so maybe I had low expectations). Thigpen has overachieved every time he’s been given a chance to play and should be given a chance to earn a starting spot. If our QB group consisted of VY, Thigpen and Charlie they would all have similar skill sets with differing levels of ability, the same gameplan would work for all of them.
by CMoney87 on Jun 20, 2011 7:50 PM PDT via mobile reply actions
I would have no qualms with the Seahawks bringing in Thigpen.
Not beating out Chad Henne in Miami has tempered my enthusiasm, but not that much. In fact, I’d rather roll the dice with him rather than Leinart or Jackson.
It would be pretty awesome to only need one gameplan.
It drives me nuts when coaches have a completely different idea of what a backup QB should look like, like Holmgren with Seneca. A backup should be exactly like your starter, just a little less awesome.
That's not always possible.
But yeah, I agree in theory.
Until this lockout business ends, you'll see me as often on the links as you will on field gulls. Also-- everytime I swing the driver, I'll imagine Roger Goodell is the ball.
by Tyler Jorgensen on Jun 21, 2011 10:11 PM PDT up reply actions
I'd argue that the imbalances schedule coupled with a prodigiously weak division was the main... suspect? in allowing us to reach the playoffs.
Which leads me to this: Does there exist any meaningful statistical measurement of a coach’s true impact on performance? Outside of a coaching change midseason—normalized for performance and environment—I can’t think of any off the top of my head.
Teams (for foreign blogs): Seahawks, Mariners, Huskies and Broncos. Yes, I recognize the contradiction; I was born in Denver.
by THolt on Jun 20, 2011 8:18 PM PDT via mobile reply actions
I've said from the beginning that VY is a great option for seattle.
He’s a player who (seemingly) has showed to protect the ball better with each growing year. He’s a danger in the deep ball and on foot. (2010 10TD 3INT)(2009-10TD 7INT) Compared to Hasselbeck’s (2010 12TD 17INT) (2009- 17TD 17INT) This seems relevant to the fact that Pete wants to protect the football.
Hoping that Cable somehow ponders up the competence to create a powerful run game, VY has the capability to open up a powerful deep ball that would even further demand problems for an opposing defense.
Not to mention Ol’ Petey has the player-friendly type relationship that could give VY a little fire under his ass as well as some encouragement to succeed.
by RawkEmHawkEmBirdbots on Jun 20, 2011 8:35 PM PDT reply actions 2 recs
Probably not.
There aren’t many VY rumors out there, but the few I found say the Redskins and the Dolphins are the frontrunners for his services. If Young is released, though, I would wonder if he would want to play for a coach (either Mike Shanahan or Tony Sparano) that’s just as much a hardass as Jeff Fisher. Pete Carroll looks much better in comparison.
Now if some team wants to overspend to bring Young in, then of course coaching style takes a back seat.
I think that's a very good point.
And if I’m Vince Young, who appears to have the occasional desire to be out of the spotlight, Seattle might be a good spot to lick the wounds.
I would love to see Young with the Hawks
I do have a tendency to love QB’s who can also run the ball well.
I think that on the field, VY is the perfect fit.
He does a pretty good job of taking car of the ball (which is PC’s like number one rule.) He has the arm strength to throw the deep ball. He is about as mobile as you can get while still having the physical body to withstand NFL punishment.
His off the field issues are the big problem. Would we really give him a chance when we didn’t give Jimmy Clausen the chance because of a lack of veteran leadership in the lockerroom? I understand the difference between a first round draft pick and picking someone up “off the street.” The big thing is he is the quarterback, not a cornerback.
That being said, I’d like to see him here. PC did a hell of a job with the team we had last year. I’d like to see what he could do with a real athlete at QB.
Earl Thomas + Mark Legree = Earl Gree. A new flavor of safety coming to you on Sunday's this Fall. They're gonna wake you up!
Were he released, I don't think he'd seek a guarantee to be "the" quarterback, and a trade precludes that possibility as well.
He’d be competing with Chuck, for sure. And I agree, he’d be an intriguing pick up. It’s pretty obvious he has the innate talent to succeed, particularly in a run-first, play action type of offense. Carroll would be a good fit, as would living/playing in what the rest of the country and national media seem to consider southern Alaska.
Teams (for foreign blogs): Seahawks, Mariners, Huskies and Broncos. Yes, I recognize the contradiction; I was born in Denver.
by THolt on Jun 20, 2011 11:05 PM PDT via mobile up reply actions
How do I put this kindly?
No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, nooooooooooooooooo!!!!!!
I would sooner leave the QB spot vacant than see Radio under center for the Seahawks. He has all the mental strength of a baked potato, is completely overhyped, and if I have to put up with VY fanboyz here (as I do on BRB) I will be forced to blow my brains out.
I could further explain why VY is not the answer, but I think I will let one of my fellow BRB writers do it for me.
Putting Vince Young In Context
Despite my better judgment, an author at Battle Red Blog.
Supreme Galactic Editor of Battle Red Onion.
I am a visionary, I am a genius, and now I am angry! Now where are those pants at?!
One "no" provides plenty of emphasis, thanks.
You’re not going to find many “fanboyz” here. Provided the cost is low enough, there’s no reason not to bring him in.
Teams (for foreign blogs): Seahawks, Mariners, Huskies and Broncos. Yes, I recognize the contradiction; I was born in Denver.
by THolt on Jun 20, 2011 11:08 PM PDT via mobile up reply actions
Would you rather VY end up up here, or with a team that gets tons of national exposure like the Redskins?
He’s going to end up SOMEWHERE, and it’s not like there’s a ton of awesome QB options out there. Hey, we all can’t have Matt Schaub as a starter.
….okay, just read your VY article. Hey, if a good QB was going to be available in free agency I’d advocate signing him instead. There are slim pickings out there, however, and sometimes you have to put all the negatives aside and hope the positives can shine brighter than anything else. I’d rather put my faith in Young than Matt Leinart.
When you see Vince Young you see David Carr, but (and I’ve belabored this point enough already) I see Michael Vick. Or something close.
by J.L. White on Jun 21, 2011 1:13 AM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
I still don't think so.
I’d sooner give Whitehurst a shot over VY. I mean worse comes to worst, if the Hawks do really badly, it’ll put them in the hunt for Andrew Luck. Not that I’m saying they should tank by any stretch of the imagination. I just really, really don’t want to see Vince Young in Seattle. He’s just not good.
Despite my better judgment, an author at Battle Red Blog.
Supreme Galactic Editor of Battle Red Onion.
I am a visionary, I am a genius, and now I am angry! Now where are those pants at?!
by UprootedTexan on Jun 21, 2011 1:29 PM PDT up reply actions
I wouldn't want to bring him in as a starter, but I'd be just fine with a true competition at QB.
He’s got a ton of talent. If he decides to work hard, well, who knows— he might just be able to develop.
Until this lockout business ends, you'll see me as often on the links as you will on field gulls. Also-- everytime I swing the driver, I'll imagine Roger Goodell is the ball.
by Tyler Jorgensen on Jun 21, 2011 10:49 PM PDT up reply actions
The problem there is that he's going to think he should be starting even if he's on the bench.
And he’ll start whining and causing problems in the locker room. That’s not even bringing up the media shitstorm that will rain down if he’s not starting immediately because, for reasons that STILL confound me, they think he’s a legitimate quarterback.
I’d just as soon avoid the matter entirely.
Despite my better judgment, an author at Battle Red Blog.
Supreme Galactic Editor of Battle Red Onion.
I am a visionary, I am a genius, and now I am angry! Now where are those pants at?!
by UprootedTexan on Jun 21, 2011 11:13 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Tell me this Why Would VY not be a starter? DO YOU HAVE A BETTER QB THAN VY?
In his first four NFL seasons (2006-09), amassed a 26-13 regular season record as a starter. His .667 winning percentage qualified as the best regular season winning percentage in franchise history and the fourth best among quarterbacks drafted between 2000-2009 (Brady, Rivers and Roethlisberger).
• Has engineered 11 career game-winning performances, leading his team to victory after a fourth-quarter deficit or tie, including six times in 2009.
• Started the final 10 games of the 2009 season, leading the team to an 8-2 finish after the club began the campaign 0-6. Named to the Pro Bowl after completing 152 of 259 passes for 1,879 yards with 10 touchdowns and seven interceptions for a career-high 82.8 passer rating.
• In 2007, directed the team to Wild Card playoff berth, becoming 11th quarterback drafted in first round since 1983 to lead his team to playoffs within his first two seasons.
• In 2006, was named Associated Press NFL Offensive Rookie of the Year, Pro Football Weekly/Pro Football Writers of America Offensive Rookie of the Year, Sports Illustrated Rookie of the Year, Sporting News Rookie of the Year and Diet Pepsi NFL Rookie of the Year (fan voting) after setting every rookie passing record for the franchise, completing 184 of 357 passes for 2,199 yards and 12 touchdowns.
• Additionally gained 552 yards on 83 rushing attempts (6.7 avg.) in 2006, becoming first quarterback in Super Bowl era (1966-present) to rush for 500 yards as rookie. Tied for team high with seven rushing touchdowns, also first for a rookie quarterback in Super Bowl era.
Before hurting his thumb he was having his best season 98.6 QB rating a whopping 16 points higher than his previous career best. In (2009QB Rating 82.8)
He completed a respectable 60 percent of his passes And win record of 30/17.
by Alway Learning on Jun 22, 2011 5:40 AM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Why shouldn't he be the starter?
You mean aside from the fact that he has a head of cabbage? Okay, let’s start with this. I just pulled this from an article by the Sporting News that was written not even a month ago.
Young is still raw as a passer and does not consistently drive into throws off his back foot. He tends to be an upright passer who is more of an arm thrower/flicker. Though he can be very accurate at times, he isn’t consistent and can miss some wide-open targets. He also needs to throw more aggressively and with better zip on 20-plus yard throws downfield. His failure to do that allows defenders to make plays on the ball. He still has a tendency to take off running as soon as he senses pressure and doesn’t make passes from outside the pocket enough. Though there are real concerns that Young has not improved as much as a passer as he should have by now, the bigger issues are about his ability to be stable and steady at a position that requires those attributes. Questions include whether he has the maturity to make good decisions, whether he will put in enough time to prepare properly, whether he can handle running an NFL offense and whether he can be a real team leader.
He’s been in the league for FIVE years now. No quarterback that’s been in the league for that long should ever be characterized as “a raw (read also: undeveloped) passer.”
Did you really just use the “Vince Young Just. Winz. Gamez.” argument? I did some looking and from 2006-2010 in the games he started and the Traitors Titans won, their opponents had a 211-262 (.446) winning percentage. Really doesn’t make that 32-15 record of his (incidentally quarterbacks shouldn’t have win/loss records since football is really the ultimate team sport) seem all that impressive. When he plays against GOOD teams (teams with records above .500) his record is 7-13 (.350). He is just not that good.
That’s when they can keep him on the field, when he doesn’t throw tantrums and toss equipment into the stands and mouth off to his coaches. I don’t even want to get into the infamous 911 call from 2008.
My question is who would want an overrated prima donna like Radio under center? To answer your question though, do I have a better QB than him? Is David Carr available? I would rather see, if it came to it, Charlie Whitehurst starting than VY; he has no business being under center unless every other quarterback in the league, and Ryan Leaf, is dead.
Despite my better judgment, an author at Battle Red Blog.
Supreme Galactic Editor of Battle Red Onion.
I am a visionary, I am a genius, and now I am angry! Now where are those pants at?!
by UprootedTexan on Jun 22, 2011 2:11 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
AL, Uprooted....as always, thr truth lies somewhere in the middle.
If Vince Young were a really good (or even above average) QB, he wouldn’t be available once the lockout gets resolved; the Titans would have bitten their tongues after the shoulderpads incident and given him another chance. But if he’s as bad as our Texans fan here says he is, then Young would have been cut after that shoulderpads incident, and no one would be interested in his services. I also believe that Young is still “raw” as a QB because he’s been stuck in Fisher’s prehistoric run-first offense his entire career.
I think “Radio” is good enough to get another chance, although I wouldn’t want my team to overpay to find out.
Well said J.L. White
VY is still young QB his footwork has improved. One thing VY hater do is focus on VY as a QB in nfl from 2006 as a rookie and 2007 his 2 year where he had a lot INT, needed work on his passing ,footwork, all the thing most QB have work on. What they don’t talk about in those 1st 2 years is that VY was not suppose to play his rookie year that why fisher brought in Collins. But Collins play bad and they put VY in .And he won Rookie of the year. His second year he took his team to the playoff.
Another thing the VY hater ignore is his improvement as a QB 2009 he took a 0-6 team and went 8-2. And in 2010 he improved his QB rating 16pt from 2009 98.6 he #1 deep passing and 4th in best passer rating on third down in the league last season.
by Alway Learning on Jun 23, 2011 7:32 AM PDT up reply actions
Even if we brought Young in, Whitehurst might still going into Training Camp as the "prohibitive starter."
There aren’t any good QB’s available in free agency, and the price to trade for Kolb is way too high (IMHO). I think Young has attributes that Pete Carroll desires in a QB, and maybe he’ll outperform his performance in Tennessee. He shouldn’t be handed the starting job, though, like it was handed to Hasselbeck last season.
Unless we acquire Palmer or Kolb, I very much want us to have a 2- or 3-man QB competition (just like the fellow above me said).
Just some counter to the arguments in the article linked...
I think that is an interesting slice of stats that put VY in a negative light by comparing him to your average QB. I think far more balanced comparison would have been to Ben, the intangbile being that Ben steps up in big games/pressure situations. That would also point to the VYs lack of mental toughness.
VY, I believe has the following to offer above and beyond most QBs (similar to Ben):
- Calm in pocket
- Ability to escape the initial pass rush, extend the play
- Tough to bring down
- Fewer turnovers
- Good arm (goes well with extending the play)
- Running threat
I think this is whay you see the bloated win percentage, he gives the team a chance. I also believe VYs presence was helpful in Chris Johnson garnering those monster stats in 2009. Not to minimize CJs efforts, but he is a quick runner and needs a just a hair of an advantage over the defense to make them miss.
Negatives would be:
- Not the most heady player
- Not a pure passer (as proven by stats)
- Doesn’t finish close games
- Off the field issues (very few)
I don’t think he will ever be a pure passer or can be taught to be “smart”. I do think a good QB coach can work with him to help him close-out games. I also think an overall positive influence can help him with his off the field choices.
Here what VY bring to a team .
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E88xjcUSKWQ
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PQ_hnbZ1lZY
VY is still young QB 1 year older than kolb and he has improve his playing each season. VY need a coach who once him and not bench at drop of the hat like Fisher.Fisher was comment to Collins allow him to lose 6 games in row only when the owner made his play VY did the team go 8-2.
by Alway Learning on Jun 22, 2011 5:54 AM PDT up reply actions
Remember
When VY single handedly beat PC and USC? I’m confident PC still does…
by Maverickngoose80 on Jun 21, 2011 4:56 AM PDT via mobile reply actions
I really can't see a downside to giving VY a flyer here.
pqlqi hit the nail on the head describing him. Making the transition from being a demi-god to being a mere mortal is tough (like I know, right?). Mike Williams faced the same problem. The difference being that BMW changed his life around BEFORE he came to Carroll looking for work. I’m not sure that VY has done that yet. But if he has, or is on his way, Pete is the perfect coach to help him along the way. I’m sure BMW had a much better chance of achieving what he has so far by playing with Carroll rather than, say, Belicheck or Shanahan.
So sign VY to a 1 year contract. If he turns up fat and lazy, then LenDale his ass. If he plays well for a few games, then throws parts of his uniform away in a hissy fit, then let him walk. But if you can figure out a way to nurture that talent, you’ll be hard pressed to find a better QB for the price. No, not hard pressed. You simply CAN’T find a better QB for the price.
Highwatermark no VY is not Fat or Lazy
During the NFL Lockout, Vince Young is staying home in Houston working with longtime trainer James Cooper.
“I’ve been working out a long time,” Young said in an interview Tuesday with KPRC-TV in Houston. " I call him my Uncle. He’s very physical, explosive type workouts that’s everything you need on a football field."
“It’s good to get out here just like you were at an OTA. Doing it more here because we are not allowed at the facilities,” said Young.
Three to four days a week, Young is joined by the likes of Adrian Peterson and other NFL stars and free agents pushing each other and creating a bond.
" It’s been that way," Young told KPRC-TV. " Adrian and the other guys are here to work. It’s a good time out here then we lift together, eat lunch, bond and build chemistry. Keeping that football brotherhood is what it’s all about."
Young is feeling 100 percent following surgery on his thumb. With his future over in Tennessee, he’s looking forward to his next stop in his career.
" I am feeling really good," said Young. " Dr. Hunt in Alabama did a great job getting me back out here. I’m getting my shoulder stronger too. It’s always good to throw with the guys and it’s helping me alot."
" I have no bitterness towards Tennessee," Young told KPRC-TV Local 2 Sports. " I am ready to play football. I have something to prove every year and I look forward to that. That’s why you see me out here getting ready, legs, body and everything."
Young added, " When the season comes, wherever I am ( Miami and Arizona are contenders), I am going in full throttle, head on right and ready to work. I want to lead my team to the playoffs and a championship and that’s all that’s on my mind, get to those areas right now."
http://www.click2houston.com/sports/27845446/detail.html
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2rUISSjVjOw
by Alway Learning on Jun 21, 2011 8:35 AM PDT reply actions 1 recs
ooh...VY in minnesota? that would be scary...
Smashmouth is the new sexy!
He's been my first pick since the beginning
Sweetnessl, finally getting some attention by fans on this site. Pick him up Carrol.
I've been thinking about it all offseason (except during our brief flirtation with Carson Palmer).
I just wish there were some rumors out there speculating about a VY-Seahawks union; there hasn’t been a peep from any sources in our organization of Young’s camp, so my guess is it probably won’t happen. But I could be wrong.
Carson has been terrible for last 3 years
by Alway Learning on Jun 22, 2011 5:55 AM PDT up reply actions
Oh, and to think I REC'd your post above...
…Palmer has been far from “terrible” the past three years. If you’re willing to forgive some of Young’s issues, there’s no way you can dismiss Palmer that strongly.
Last year Palmer threw for 3,970 yards, 61.8 completion %, 26 TDs and 20 INTs.
A high number of picks, to be sure, but last season Palmer had 586 pass attempts, so unless you’re Tom Brady racking up that many picks isn’t all that bad.
Those aren’t All-pro numbers, but not terrible, either; considering the effort the Seahawks are putting into the running game, I doubt any QB we bring in will have to throw that many passes in a year. I think he’s well worth a 3rd rounder.
Listen if VY played the way Palmer played I say the same about him.
Palmer has not been good in long time . And you want talk about QB quitting on his team? He had better receiver than VY .
by Alway Learning on Jun 23, 2011 7:40 AM PDT up reply actions
I'd say that Kenny Britt was better than Ocho Cinco last year.
Well, Britt was quite inconsistent and only played in 12 games, but Chad just wasn’t good.
Looking over Carson’s career stats, except for getting hurt in 2008 he’s been consistent really good his entire (starting) career, while being great in 2005 and 2006 (and his stats are eerily consistent and good for 2007, 2009 and 2010….the latter 2 years played without one of his favorite receivers, Housh). I just don’t understand the anti-Palmer sentiment.
He's a pretty terrible player.
Tanking for Luck>>>>>Vince Young. Folding the franchise>>>Vince Young.
And the devil in the hot pink dress tryin' to ask me for one dance.
He think he slick but my guardians protect me from his wrath.
by Colts Homer on Jul 13, 2011 3:47 PM PDT reply actions 1 recs
I get that you have to hate on division rival QBs, but please don't post stuff like this here.
1) If you’re going to call someone “terrible” (especially when following it with that kind of hyperbole) then back it up.
2) He’s not terrible, he’s mediocre. 57.9% career completion rate, even TD:INT throwing…but has a few attributes that our staff is rumored to want (mobility, strong arm).
3) See what I did there?
So rec'd
"I throw, you catch. It's NOT that hard!"
Peyton Manning, SNL, 2007
by peytonsthebest on Jul 14, 2011 8:24 AM PDT up reply actions
Thanks for coming over to pour hate on a division rival's player, I guess?
It’s not very constructive information for us, I’m afraid
by Thomas Beekers on Jul 14, 2011 10:04 AM PDT up reply actions
I think you should take into consideration
the we may have seen more games with VY than you. He’s not only a complete head case, lock room cancer but as pointed out above, the fact that he’s been in the league for 5 years and still doesn’t have his mechanics down is absurd. But, hey, y’all can dream right?
You should go over the Music City Miracles and see how the Titans’ fans feel about him. I promise you that they feel pretty much the same way we do.
"I throw, you catch. It's NOT that hard!"
Peyton Manning, SNL, 2007
by peytonsthebest on Jul 14, 2011 10:16 AM PDT up reply actions
Just saying "I hate him" isn't very informative
Pointing out you’ve seen more games is an appeal to authority.
Vince Young has shown mediocrity through most of his career, is a hilarious basket case and ran a weirdly limited run-option offense that I hated. And the Titans are my least favorite team in the NFL. That doesn’t mean he wouldn’t be an interesting high-upside FA if he joins us. Most of us aren’t dreaming of him as the savior tho.
by Thomas Beekers on Jul 14, 2011 11:52 AM PDT up reply actions
Nobody said "I hate him."
If anything I feel sorry for him.
What’s wrong with Football Jesus? I thought there was quite a bit of hope for him.
"I throw, you catch. It's NOT that hard!"
Peyton Manning, SNL, 2007
by peytonsthebest on Jul 14, 2011 12:38 PM PDT up reply actions
There's two recent writeups on him here on FG if you're really curious
But they’re long. Long story short is: he sucks at progression reading and is a bit of a project at Age 28. Kinda like Vince Young. Or Matt Leinart. That’s why Seahawks fans wouldn’t mind seeing those kind of young but some upside guys come in and compete. We might get lucky. We probably won’t, but hey, worth a shot.
by Thomas Beekers on Jul 14, 2011 12:50 PM PDT up reply actions
Hey, there's nothing wrong with competition.
And maybe, just maybe Carroll could get VY under control. He has potential to be good, he just seems to lack the mental toughness to get there.
"I throw, you catch. It's NOT that hard!"
Peyton Manning, SNL, 2007
by peytonsthebest on Jul 14, 2011 2:10 PM PDT up reply actions
Physically, he's a world-beater.
Mentally, he’s an egg-beater.
I’d pass.
"Football players are temperamental. That's 90 percent temper and 10 percent mental." - Doug Plank
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