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Assessing the Seahawks Roster: Defensive Ends

When you have biceps that big, you must be good at football. I'm starting the Bring Vernon Gholston To Seattle petition here.

The defensive end position for the Seahawks is actually one spot that I'm relatively confident in. The way the Seahawks' 4-3 Under defense works is rather unique in the NFL and requires 'specialized' type players. As Pete Carroll put it, "The defensive end to the tight end side needs to be a defensive player that can play the run. He does not have to be a big time pass rusher." He also, at times, needs to 2-gap. This is where Red Bryant made his money in 2010, pre-injury, and where he'll hopefully bounce back at and dominate. If Red is unable to recover enough to play at the level he did in 2010, all hope is not lost. Kentwan Balmer and Pep Levingston are possible replacements and give you a little breathing room in the case of an injury (though not ideal).

The LEO defensive end is a specialized player position as well. Pete Carroll describes the LEO position as thus:

"The best pass rusher on the team is usually the defensive end to the open side of the field. That puts him on the quarterback's blind side and makes him a C gap player in this defense. We often align him wider than this in order to give him a better angle of attack and allow him to play in space. We align him a yard outside of the offensive tackle most of the time. He has to play C gap run support but at the same time he is rushing the passer like it is third and ten. He has to be able to close down however if the tackle blocks down on him."

"(He) has to be one of your best football players. Size does not matter as much. We want an athletic player who can move around."

In other words, he has to rush the passer like a banshee but also maintain his gap against the run. In my opinion, Chris Clemons did his job there masterfully in 2010. I doubt he's in much danger of losing his starting position but even in the case of an injury, I believe that young Dexter Davis has a lot of potential in that spot as well. Both players are fast, good tacklers, explosive off the edge, and hungry. Color me satisfied with our LEOs at this point (even KJ Wright presents some skills that could be applicable at the spot in a pinch.)

So, in my view, the LEO position has, at worst, an acceptable starter and depth. The 5-tech defensive end position has a presumptive starter in Red Bryant but depth will need to be added. Let's take a look at what could happen.

Star-divide

On the Roster:

5-tech
Red Bryant
Pep Levingston
Kentwan Balmer (tweener)
Amon Gordon
AJ Schable (??? - also listed as TE and FB on some sites... so I don't know WTF the Hawks plan with him)

LEO
Chris Clemons
Dexter Davis
KJ Wright (possible)

Free Agent Possibilities (that I like):
Charles Johnson
Ray Edwards
Mathias Kiwanuka
Vernon Gholston
Jay Richardson
Junior Siavii
Alan Branch
Raheem Brock

UDFAs (that I like):
Brandon Bair, Oregon
Ugo Chinasa, OK St.
John Graves, Virginia Tech

The Lowdow:

I don't know much about Amon Gordon or AJ Schable so I can't speak with any confidence one way or another on them. They are most likely camp bodies or practice squad guys but could surprise. Pep Levingston will probably be a bubble player in training camp but could ultimately make the 53-man roster, depending on moves made by the Hawks.

If they sign a guy like Alan Branch (or even Junior Siavii or Jay Richardson) Levingston could see himself moving down the depth charts from his presumptive no.2 or no.3 spot behind Red Bryant and Kentwan Balmer at the moment (Kentwan Balmer is, in reality, more likely to back up Bryant this season) and would be in danger of getting cut (to the practice squad if he clears waivers). I would welcome an Alan Branch addition, based mostly on his play against the Seahawks in 2010 (where he tore our o-line a new a-hole), and the fact he's still young, and relatively versatile. Apart from that, I really don't see a big-splash move in free agency happening at either end of the defensive line. 

Raheem Brock played a more traditional 4-3 end role last year after Red Bryant went down and got 9 sacks in the process. It's unclear if they'll want him back, but assuming both Bryant and Clemons are healthy, he may not see many snaps. I suppose it's up to the Hawks front office to decide whether they want the insurance he provides them in the event of an injury. 

In terms of the LEO end spot: Ray Edwards and Charles Johnson will cost a lot, and don't really fit the profile of a LEO end in the first place so I'll assume they're out. Mathias Kiwanuka is a real option, but again, will cost a lot and I'm not sure the Seahawks are looking to add payroll to a 'deepish' position. On the other hand, I can see them bringing in other teams' castoffs, notably Vernon Gholston, to give it a shot at the position, much like they did last season with Ricky Foley. Gholston was a LEO end in Ohio State's defense and did so well there that he was drafted 6th overall. Too bad the Jets run a 3-4 defense and Gholston sucks as playing in a 3-4. He does have freakish athletic ability though, was most successful in a position similar to the one he'd be asked to play here, and would be very cheap. Why the hell not?

There are a batch of UDFAs that could be intriguing as well. 

Brandon Bair, Oregon

Brandon Bair is a high energy defensive end that could be a low cost option as depth at the LEO spot and he could play the 5-tech as well. He's 6'6 275 and uses his long arms to use for leverage and to disengage blocks. He uses a variety of moves well to get to the QB and is a high-effort, high motor player. He has good instincts and bats down a lot of balls at the line of scrimmage. Could even play a little DT in passing situations so his versatility could prove helpful to him landing a job. He'd be a 26 year old rookie if signed as he spend 2 years on a LDS mission.

Ugo Chinasa, Oklahoma State

Chinasa is a guy that I could see the Hawks looking at as a possible LEO end. He's very fast off the edge and gets good leverage on his way to the QB. He's played DE from a standup position at Oklahoma State so he knows that role well. In his final two seasons there he registered 10.5 sacks and when he's playing at full speed he's got all the weapons you'd want from that position. His main knock is his effort though, so a team that believes they can light a fire under his ass will pick him up. The Hawks could work with their "always compete" mantra.

John Graves, Virginia Tech

Graves is another guy that I could see as depth at the 5-tech position and reminds me a bit of Pep Levingston in that a lot of scouting reports on him point out that he'd need to be used in a specific scheme (3-4 DE or Pete Carroll's 5-tech Red Bryant spot) but could be effective if so. He's a good athlete that can get off blocks well, is a hard worker and team leader.

Conclusion:

I think the Hawks will go into the season with, as locks, Red Bryant, Chris Clemons, Kentwan Balmer and Dexter Davis. Past that, they could pick up a free agent possibly, perhaps Alan Branch or bring back Jay Richardson/Junior Siavii/Raheem Brock. I'm sure they'll sign a UDFA or two to come in and compete at both spots as well. All in all, it's hard to predict. The depth is more of an issue here than the starting players, but who knows how well Big Red will recover from his injury. It could complicate things if he's not ready. 

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It makes perfect sense that he is a liability on paper

I went into the season fully expecting him to be. I never saw that he was, not to a significant extent. I think that has a lot to do with how our D-line is shifted and the fact that our soundest and fastest tackler is at his back.

by Thomas Beekers on Jul 22, 2011 12:34 PM PDT up reply actions  

On paper, yes

In actuality, it doesn’t. I think a lot of people are still just objecting to trading away Tapp and don’t like the idea of playing an asymmetric DL (even though all offenses are asymmetric and almost all DLs are).

One concern I had last year was that the uber-specialization of the DL may force us to keep a much larger number of DL on our roster (1 starter+1 backup for each plus extras), but I think we can manage reasonably well with backups that play multiple “DT” positions (1-tech, 3-tech, 5-tech) as long as they’re not Kentwan Balmer or some random guy off the street.

by Greetings from the Lord Humongous! on Jul 22, 2011 12:45 PM PDT up reply actions  

I think Branch is a great fit for this reason

He could start at 3-tech and be the depth at 5-tech should Red go down with Balmer playing the 3-tech.

by Flamefox111 on Jul 22, 2011 12:49 PM PDT up reply actions  

Clemons really surprised me in a good way but....

I think we may have seen different games. Clemons is easily controlled by any NFL LT at the point of attack. His quickness sometimes helps him get around quick enough if a back does not hit the hole as he should. However, he is not only shielded at will he is easily pushed back in any short yardage situation. I saw this time and time again. Luckily we had Cole who more than holds his own and takes up 2 blockers in short yardage. In obvious short yardage situation Clemons should come out. This is why he is only a specialty player. But with all due respect, he was sensational at applying pressure and showed some amazing coverage skills which helped us be a little unpredictable,

Respect goes a long way....

by Mangolover on Jul 23, 2011 1:44 AM PDT up reply actions  

That's the point though

The question was not whether a LT couldn’t bully Clemons, of course they can, the fear was that in this system Clemons’ lack of strength would lead to a marked weakness for weakside runs. This failed to materialize to a significant degree.

by Thomas Beekers on Jul 23, 2011 8:10 AM PDT up reply actions  

Perception is interesting....

I felt Clemons was pushed around like a rag doll and everyone had to help out by cheating a little his way which in turn hurt the rest of the defense vs the run. If Mebane or whatever DT plays on Clemons side gets sealed off and the team has a good blocking FB to take out our WIL, we just gave the O the biggest 3 hole possible. Throw in a good RG slowing Cole just a little allowing the Center to seal Lofa and you have a 1 on 1 with a RB and our Safety 10-15 yards past the LOS. Then players have to cheat creating other weaknesses vs the run. That then creates problems vs the pass

I still do not understand why we often have our CBs play 10-12 yards off the ball. I am hoping that was due to not having the type of press corner PC likes but it makes it almost impossible to cover a WR tight.

Respect goes a long way....

by Mangolover on Jul 23, 2011 12:50 PM PDT up reply actions  

That's not really cheating his way, we run an under defense. It's unusual, but they're supposed to cheat towards the weakside

We funnel runs, even those through the middle, towards our weakside to be picked up by Hawthorne. This is all by design, and I can’t say it worked badly. Our run defense problems came when our strongside line started crumbling. There’ll be an article up on this tomorrow.

And yeah, our CBs played a lot of loose man. It’s all about lack of press skills. It’s not what PC wants to run ideally.

by Thomas Beekers on Jul 23, 2011 2:06 PM PDT up reply actions  

When teams have crappy DBs, they run more zone

I think we’ll use more press, man coverage as the DB corps becomes stronger (as LeGree takes over “center field”, leaving ET to roam and if we sign a guy like Joseph).

by Greetings from the Lord Humongous! on Jul 23, 2011 4:57 PM PDT up reply actions  

I agree Lord H

but I think the center field usually refers to the free safety. I like LeGree a ton but I am worried the lockout will hurt him a little. I do feel eventually we may run some LS/RS rather than the typical SS/FS system.

Let’s hope some big CB surprises us in a good way. My bet is Browner or Maxwell over the Stanford kid. Joseph would be a dream come true I like that thought!

Respect goes a long way....

by Mangolover on Jul 24, 2011 10:49 PM PDT up reply actions  

well I hear ya but

We were forced to cheat toward Clemons side since he is unable to hold his own at the point of attack. Having Red in makes us run basically a 3-4 defense so its not a problem using Clemons in that regard but without Red we were unable to cover up for Clemons. Maybe we just see things differently. I can guarantee you that PC would be very happy if Clemons could hold his ground a little better when needed.

About our CBs playing 10-12 yards off I can also say with strong conviction that is hard on any CB and mandates under help usually from an OLB creating more problems for our D. However, Clemons is very good at that for a DE. The problem with a CB playing so deep is a QB does not have to be extremely accurate which is why the press is so valuable.

IMHO, Jennings is a very good press CB vs any WR who is not huge and he seems, with Wilson gone, the only guy who can turn and run with a speed guy. The one thing that Jennings is great at he was not given much of a chance to do with the Hawks so the fans that dont get it really hate him. when we have all 6-2 or 6-3 CBs like most fans want they will understand why that will not work faster than you can say Wes Welker or Deshaun Jackson.

Keep up the great work Field Gulls!

Respect goes a long way....

by Mangolover on Jul 24, 2011 10:37 PM PDT up reply actions  

Changes in copy:

Please replace the phrase:
tore our o-line a new a-hole
with
tore our o-line a new a-gap

Never mind, leave it as it is.

by goatweed on Jul 22, 2011 12:16 PM PDT reply actions   2 recs

Like I mentioned elsewhere, I'd love to bring in Gholston

Not that I expect anything, but it’s exactly the kind of move PC has excelled at. It doesn’t always work out, far from it, but I love these high-upside specific-fit guys.

by Thomas Beekers on Jul 22, 2011 12:36 PM PDT reply actions  

Best Gholston play ever at tOSU was watching him blow up Jake Long on his way to a sack.

Can’t find it to link to, but it was a fine, fine day among many OSU blowout wins of UM. All Buckeyes would gladly see Rob Rose escorted out the door in favor of ANY other. (http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/columns/story?columnist=kiper_jr_mel&id=3119038). Would love to see him in a hawks uniform.

Armchair Linebacker

by YoSoyMacho on Jul 22, 2011 12:49 PM PDT up reply actions  

What I thought was interesting (and I didn't know this at the time, although at the time I thought Gholston incredibly over drafted)...

…is that he wasn’t a good fit in New York. It makes sense, though, in that playing a 3/4 LB is a different skill set then a LEO DE (not unlike the limitations we have talked about related to Curry – just different) so if he could succeed more as a pure pass rusher then Seattle might make sense for him.

by Hawksince77 on Jul 22, 2011 1:21 PM PDT up reply actions  

I think that's one of the defining features of the LEO:

The 3-4 scheme is able to make use of pass-rushers too small to play in a 4-3, but many of these guys aren’t able to pick up the LB skills and end up underperforming. The LEO scheme is able to use these guys where other schemes may not.

by Greetings from the Lord Humongous! on Jul 22, 2011 2:00 PM PDT up reply actions  

Exactly!

Bringing Gholston in is a no lose situation. If he sucks, you move on,; if he can recapture what he showed in college—lotto! Kinda like bringing in BMW last year. I say do it!

by Flahawker on Jul 22, 2011 1:36 PM PDT up reply actions  

I've wonder about VG too

Dude was a 4-3 DE in college, not a 3-4 backer. In our hybrid scheme, he could definitely work in the LEO role.

Beer, its not just for breakfast anymore.

by Dougula on Jul 22, 2011 4:14 PM PDT up reply actions  

Any word from the Red Bryant camp

on his physical condition right now? Is this dude ready to be counted on for 16 games?

Alan Branch swinging between the 1 and 5 tech spots makes too much sense. It’s really a matter of which player he is better than by the most (Red or Cole).

I’d also love to see Gholston and Bair in camp, but then we’re still left with a huge hole at the 3 tech spot. Even if Mebane is resigned, Carroll is stuck with a skill set that is less than ideal within the scheme. Is there a better solution out there though? Not in the above list of players.

by FWBrodie on Jul 22, 2011 1:55 PM PDT reply actions  

How much would signing Mebane, Gholston and Branch run us?

I doubt VG would be all too much but I also think hes the least needed out of those 3. Would it be possible to sign those 3 and still have enough for a QB and CB?

by Veilside on Jul 22, 2011 4:45 PM PDT reply actions  

I think Mebane wants $8M/year

Branch is probably a $2-4M/year guy and Gholston would probably be relatively cheap if there was mutual interest.

by Greetings from the Lord Humongous! on Jul 22, 2011 4:55 PM PDT up reply actions  

I'd be pretty damn happy to make those signings for the DL.

Bane at 1 or 3 tech, Branch at 1 or 3 tech plus depth at 5 tech or have both him and Red in on obvious running plays, Gholston at LEO or in with Clemons during obvious pass plays.

by Veilside on Jul 22, 2011 5:04 PM PDT up reply actions  

that would be a really nice look for us...

GOD I’M EXCITED FOR THIS SEASON!!!

"I was 11 or 12 and Quinton was like 30. He was the only dude on the Pop Warner team who had a full mustache and a beard. And he used to drive to Pop Warner games. You're not supposed to be doing that. It was crazy." -Marshawn Lynch

by IMIN4LIFE on Jul 22, 2011 5:30 PM PDT up reply actions  

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