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Seahawks Beat Raiders 20-3, A Closer Look

So, I figure you can find a play-by-play recap just about anywhere so when I went back and rewatched the game I didn't do so with an eye for telling you exactly what happened. Instead, I wanted to focus on position groups and individual players and how they fared. I'll break it down for you this way.

Offense:

I really like the group we have in the backfield. Marshawn Lynch didn't play but I sort of forget this because the combination of Leon Washington, Justin Forsett, Michael Robinson, Thomas Clayton, and Vai Taua has been impressive. Leon is that one-cut and go type of shifty runner that has potential to get a lot of carries in this zone running scheme. Washington had a great heads-up play on a badly thrown and deflected pass by Charlie Whitehurst that he took for 30 odd yards downfield on a third down. Sometimes the ball just bounces your way, and it was sweet revenge (well, not that sweet considering it was preseason this time for us) for this play last season against the Raiders where Michael Bush grabbed a deflected pass and ran it for a huge gain. Good to see luck back on our side for one night anyway.

Forsett has looked good running between the tackles, consistently breaks tackles and is dangerous on swing passes and screens. This was displayed last night when he grabbed a screen pass from Tarvaris Jackson with one hand and ran it for 19 yards and a first down. This play came on a 3rd and 15 in the Seahawks first drive -- a drive that started with two no-gains on runs, then a James Carpenter false start to put them in a bad situation. 

The fact that the Seahawks successfully ran a screen play was a triumph in itself, but the timing was very important. It kept the drive going, kept the offense on the field, and helped them find some rhythm. If they had gone three and out there it could have been a game-changing and confidence killing type of situation, but they made it happen, so that was good to see. 

Michael Robinson looks good. He's significantly bigger than last year but doesn't appear to have lost a step. He also caught a screen pass out of the backfield on a 3rd down in the first quarter (same drive) and picked up some great yards after the catch for 15 yards and first down. 

Thomas Clayton has been impressive. He averaged almost 4 yards a carry last night and on a third quarter, 14-play drive, I believe he carried the ball eight times and helped the Seahawks chew up over eight minutes on the clock. Like I said last night -- running helps you protect a lead, keep the defense off the field, and wears down your opponent. I like Clayton because he's versatile and runs very hard. I don't think they keep him over Justin Forsett though. 

Vai Taua had a good game running the ball too. He runs with a little different style than Clayton I think. He's more apt to let the play develop and let the blockers do their job in front of him. I saw on Taua display patience behind the line, waiting for the hole to open up. He doesn't run as explosively but he runs behind his pads and follows his lead blocker well. I really like Taua but doubt he has a spot on the roster. He might be a practice squad candidate. 

Star-divide

The offensive line. I was glad to see the o-line offer Tarvaris Jackson some protection. He was able to complete some passes, lets plays develop, and move the ball down the field. Carpenter got significant action and looked good. He played well into the fourth quarter so it was nice to see them giving him some game reps -- that experience will be needed for a big guy like James. I think he'll get better as the season goes along and he gets more comfortable in the scheme (and on the right). 

I didn't watch the o-line super closely but the Hawks ran the ball fairly well and gave our quarterbacks time so overall I'd say they improved. The second team offensive line has been dominating second team defenses all preseason and last night wasn't any different. It's nice to know that you have functional backups.

Cut blocking is a big part of this scheme, and it will take a little getting used to. When I've gone back and rewatched some of the Hawks preseason games, I've noticed that on more than a few occasions, the pressure on Tarvaris Jackson comes because of missed cut blocks. When you think of cut blocks you typically would think of rushing plays downfield but I've noticed the Hawks employing them in pass protection as well -- for instance, both tackles will just try and cut the defensive ends off the snap. If the defensive end plays it slow and stays upright, he then has an offensive tackle laying on the ground in front of him and a clear line to the quarterback. This type of thing is probably new to some of our personnel so I'd encourage you to be patient with it as they figure out the nuances needed. 

This cut-blocking thing is not all bad though, and you can see players catching on -- on one play in particular in the fourth quarter, the second/third team o-line opened up a gigantic hole for Vai Taua to run through and into the endzone, and it was made possible by three well-placed cut blocks. See below:

Screen_shot_2011-09-03_at_8

You can see Paul McQuistan, the left guard, just laying down a TEXTBOOK cut-block downfield, flipping the linebacker practically on his head. But the hole is opened up beautifully in the backfield by LT William Robinson and TE Dominique Byrd laying down effective blocks as well. Overall, this is the type of execution you hope for when you draw up plays. Taua went through the hole hard and was untouched into the endzone. 

In general though, the Seahawks did a good job of mitigating the issues on the offensive line by successfully employing pressure-beating plays. Rollouts, bootlegs, screens. Tarvaris and Charlie looked good on these plays and Whitehurst in particular made some impressive throws on bootlegs to keep drives going. 

The Seahawks receivers have looked good as well. Though it wasn't an ideal situation by any stretch to have these guys starting, but Kris Durham and Golden Tate sort of helped me forget that Mike Williams and Sidney Rice were on the sideline in street clothes. Durham looked the part and though his stat-line said 1 reception for 9 yards, he also had a nice deep dig on a rollout pass from Tarvaris Jackson that went for 26 yards but was called back for something I can't remember. Either way, he looks smooth out there, and has displayed good hands. On his one official reception, he used all of his 6'6 frame to go up for a high pass in the redzone and came down on the one-yard line. Having this type of big target is likely what John Schneider envisioned when he drafted Durham. 

When I went back and re-watched the game, the one main thing that stuck out to me was that Golden Tate played lights out. People remember his big 43-yard reception downfield but he had 4 other catches and at least two of them were very high degree of difficulty. His first catch came in high and he went up and plucked it out of the air for a first down. Later, he reached down and to his right to grab a ball that came in really low and behind him. These are not easy plays and it was so damn good to see him make them. He also displayed an ability to find the open spot in the zone and he was the bailout on several plays which shows he did a good job of coming back to the ball when a play breaks down.

I really think last night was a statement game for Tate and I'm hoping he can keep that swagger as we go into the regular season. It might just be me, but Tate NEEDS that swagger back. He knows he's a good player, but has yet to prove it to anyone. He showed us glimpses of what he can do last night.

Defense:

Overall the defense stonewalled the Raiders pretty well. I love that they kept them out of the endzone and I think they did a pretty good job of sticking to their gameplan and philosophy. Keep the ball in front of you. Play within yourself. There weren't many 'big' plays, but it was more of a team effort on the defensive side to discourage and demoralize the Raiders.

The defensive secondary situation is as muddled to me as it was coming into the game. Atari Bigby, Jeron Johnson, Josh Pinkard, and Mark LeGree all played solidly, and no one really was head and shoulders above the rest. My gut would tell me that Jeron Johnson is the real deal, and looks the most natural out there of the group. He's fast and instinctual, and had a nice blitz off the edge where he blasted the running back in the backfield for a loss. He looked good in coverage too, so he's really made a nice case for himself to make the roster. Pinkard and LeGree played well enough to keep their names in the discussion too -- LeGree had a good play in pass coverage on a slot receiver on a 4th and 4 mid fourth quarter - he put pressure on the catch, and the Raiders' receiver McGee missed the ball. Good heads up play from Legree that got Gus Bradley onto the field fist pumping wildly.

I don't envy this front office in the final decisions today but it will be the most interesting group to watch for.

The defensive line depth showed signs of life. Lazarius Levingston looks great from the interior on passing downs. He showed an ability to get into the backfield and collapse the pocket. He has good get-off, violent hands to get off blocks. High-energy. 

I am as excited about this as I am surprised. I thought they had drafted him to be a backup five-tech end but he has looked lively rushing the passer from the inside. He was credited with half a sack but he nearly had another one as well when he forced Kyle Boller to throw the ball into the ground as he hit him (see picture above, he's behind Boller). 

Next to him, DT David Howard has quietly looked good as well as a penetrating nose tackle type on passing downs. I didn't notice much of DT Clinton McDonald but the Hawks depth a defensive tackle is looking a little less tenuous to me at the moment. That might be a snap judgement based on this game alone, but so be it. Right now, I'm feeling better about it. Levingston and/or McDonald could come in as situational pass rushers from 3-tech/nose tackle position and used in combination with David Howard on passing downs could be interesting.

The secondary did their jobs well enough last night. They kept the Raiders out of the endzone so that was a positive. Richard Sherman looked good. He got a bump pass interference call on one pass play but reached out and deflected the pass as it came in to the receiver. I think the call was correct, but that kind of thing gets overlooked as often as it gets called. The take away was that Sherman used his length and got his head around to break up the pass. Carroll loves these long-limbed guys that narrow throwing lanes for quarterbacks and generally just make outside passes harder to connect on.

Kennard Cox had a couple of nice plays, but I don't see him making the 53. Byron Maxwell didn't look outstanding but I think will still be on the cusp. Browner looked fine. I didn't watch the corners especially closely and without coaches tape its pretty hard to tell what they're doing when they're off screen. The key thing is that they didn't give up many big plays for huge gains, and this was the bane of the Seahawks defense last season. 

Aaron Curry had a pretty good first half. On a 3rd and 2 with 1:29 in first quarter, he blew up a run from the weakside linebacker position - shed the lead blocking fullback and stuffed the run in the backfield. The other play that people were complaining about, where he didn't wrap up on Michael Bush, was blatant holding that didn't get called. It's tough to wrap up with the guy blocking you has your arms handcuffed behind your back. Either way, he looked good, and has still been playing from the weakside a lot (if not exclusively) -- something that nobody is really talking about, inexplicably. (Something we'll have a lot more on that very soon - Dukeshire has been putting something together)...

Other than that - Raheem Brock looked good. Dexter Davis got some snaps and didn't really convince me either way whether or not he'll be in the Hawks plans going forward. That's about all I got for now. Obviously, we'll revisit the game throughout the week with more but I wanted to share my initial reactions.

OH, and I thought this was funny: Breno Giacomini showing some of that Tom Cable NASTY by straight up pwning Raiders defensive end Tommie Hill.

First, you see Hill essentially punching Giacomini in the face after a play had been whistled dead. 

Screen_shot_2011-09-03_at_1

Giacomini doesn't appreciate this transgression. He responds by putting Hill on his backside.

Screen_shot_2011-09-03_at_1Screen_shot_2011-09-03_at_1

You can see Hill's head falling out of the corner of the screen there to the bottom right.

Screen_shot_2011-09-03_at_1

As Mike Mayock would say, "GET OFF ME!"

Anyway, I thought that was funny. 

Injuries: Robert Gallery and Jimmy Wilkerson hurt their knees and could be out for a significant amount of time, so that is something to watch. Not great news.

I'll end with a poll -- who has been the Seahawks best RedZone performer in this preseason? Check it out below:

Poll
Who was the best preseason RedZone performer for the Seahawks?
Dominique Byrd
29 votes
Anthony McCoy
79 votes
Charlie Whitehurst
75 votes
Thomas Clayton
94 votes
Leon Washington
35 votes
Tarvaris Jackson
10 votes

322 votes | Poll has closed

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The blocking was the main thing I was watching for in this game, and it actually looked halfway decent

It’s just one game, but the way they had been looking before was incredibly worrisome. As you said this goes a long way towards putting to bed some of those fears.

Thanks for the writeups, Danny!

by Kingdomer on Sep 3, 2011 9:49 AM PDT reply actions  

That's not smart by Giacomini. The guy with the second infraction usually gets the flag

Also, our pass protection was bailed out by the Raiders lack of pass rush, after we faced three good pass-rushing teams. Similarly, our pass defense’s lack of pass rush put a lot of pressure on the secondary, but they were bailed out by the weakness of the Raiders receiving game.

This wasn’t so much a good game as a game where our strengths just matched up well with theirs.

Formerly Known As Vasilii

by Thomas Beekers on Sep 3, 2011 9:50 AM PDT reply actions  

I don't think so either

but I think that there is definitely some sort of improvement from the offense. Carpenter if I’m not mistaken was sprinkled in throughout the entire game, and I think it was good for him to run up against 2nd teamers just to sort of start adjusting to the 1st teamers. I think that at this point you know that he won’t be able to match up right away against feature pass rushers, but getting him experience and teaching him technique throughout the first half of the season while rotating him in/out like, say, every other series will get him what he needs and maybe after the 1/2 way point of the season he can be what we hoped.
The secondary is the most glaring weakness, obviously, but I see flashes of real brilliance from those young guys back there. They seem to be fast but their technique just seems to be a bit off. They’re not where they should be on certain plays, but I think that comes with experience again.
If one phrase will summarize this entire season, it’s ‘growing pains’. All these young guys need something under their belts, and this season has to be it.

An open mind is like a fortress with its gates unbarred and unguarded.

by Corax --Nevermore-- on Sep 3, 2011 10:00 AM PDT up reply actions  

Carpenter has stayed in to block against second-teamers all preseason, just like Moffitt and Polumbus

The new thing here was the rotation with McQuistan to make a decision on who is our starting RT.

Formerly Known As Vasilii

by Thomas Beekers on Sep 3, 2011 10:06 AM PDT up reply actions  

Right, sorry, Giacomini

Same difference

Formerly Known As Vasilii

by Thomas Beekers on Sep 3, 2011 10:09 AM PDT up reply actions  

I think I got a touch of the flu

Don’t expect much intelligent commentary from me today.

Not that you guys normally would, but y’know…

Formerly Known As Vasilii

by Thomas Beekers on Sep 3, 2011 10:14 AM PDT up reply actions  

Agreed, not to be glass-is-half-empty guy, but...

I think the Raiders are a pretty terrible team right now. They would have to be among the worst few teams in the league at this point. It is good to see our guys have some success, and I especially hope Tate can use this game to turn a corner and build on it. Clearly, he has big-time ability; he just needs confidence and the right approach to improving his technique and the details and nuances at this level.

by IslandHawk on Sep 3, 2011 10:26 AM PDT up reply actions  

really?

An open mind is like a fortress with its gates unbarred and unguarded.

by Corax --Nevermore-- on Sep 3, 2011 10:00 AM PDT up reply actions  

He is

New rules. His accrued season on IR doesn’t count because he was never one the active roster for 9 games.

Formerly Known As Vasilii

by Thomas Beekers on Sep 3, 2011 10:04 AM PDT up reply actions  

Well, neat!

Stash him.

http://17power.blogspot.com

by Brandon8 on Sep 3, 2011 10:59 AM PDT up reply actions  

He's shown a lot.

God, the PS is so nerve-wracking. Everybody is just dangling out there, exposed.

If you're not sure if there's a quarterback controversy, there is one.

by shams on Sep 3, 2011 11:58 AM PDT up reply actions  

I think we can live with Clayton being nabbed by someone, to be honest

I’d be more concerned if guys like Baldwin, Portis or Johnson are put on the PS.

Formerly Known As Vasilii

by Thomas Beekers on Sep 3, 2011 12:11 PM PDT up reply actions  

I agree especially with Baldwin and Portis, haven't payed much attention to Johnson

but Clayton does look like a perfect runner for ZBS, gets up to the line fast and makes the first cut fast. It would be nice to be able to keep him and have him develop into a 1500 yard 15 touchdown rusher. Sure, it’s unlikely, but it would be nice.

Smashmouth is the new sexy!

by pqlqi on Sep 3, 2011 12:15 PM PDT up reply actions  

Clayton hasn't impressed me with the speed of his cuts

He’s best when he can run in a straight line.

Formerly Known As Vasilii

by Thomas Beekers on Sep 3, 2011 12:27 PM PDT up reply actions  

I hope they find a spot for Clayton

If they keep him, then that’s probably five RB, including Michael Robinson, which might be too many…but I’m sure some team could use his services and he won’t likely make it to our practice squad

by Hawkguy on Sep 3, 2011 9:59 AM PDT reply actions  

That more like it, Golden

Get that shine back & pass the crow this way

by broadbill birdwatcher on Sep 3, 2011 9:59 AM PDT reply actions  

Golden will probably have a key drop in the next game that will have people gnash their teeth again

He’s a raw, talented WR, these type of games are as much a part of it as dunderheaded games.

Formerly Known As Vasilii

by Thomas Beekers on Sep 3, 2011 10:10 AM PDT up reply actions  

Whitehurst looked pissed off during the game

He kept shaking his head. I couldn’t tell if he was shaken, pissed, or what. But it was kind of interesting to see SOME emotion out of him

by Hawkguy on Sep 3, 2011 10:02 AM PDT reply actions  

Yup, but I feel his demeanor and body language continue to hurt him.

Seems as if he is too hard on himself, and a bit of more positive thinking and swagger might go a long way. Easy for us armchair guys to say, hard to execute. Not everyone is wired the same way.

by IslandHawk on Sep 3, 2011 10:30 AM PDT up reply actions  

That's what I saw too

I kinda wanted to see him go over to his teammates and give them an earful or something. Not be a jerk, but a leader. Something Hasselbeck would have done.

by Hawkguy on Sep 3, 2011 11:13 AM PDT up reply actions  

After the first two plays and then the false start, things looked bleak.

Danny was right, that 3rd down conversion was huge for that first drive. T-Jack looked pretty good when he had time.

by Hawkguy on Sep 3, 2011 10:21 AM PDT reply actions  

Agree about Maxwell on the cusp

With only 1(?) punt last night, he didn’t have a chance to show off his special teams value, but last week he was a beast at gunner. I think that could win him a spot.

by MapleBar on Sep 3, 2011 10:35 AM PDT reply actions  

I think this was a bit of evidence that TJ could look better with more time in the pocket

He’s definitely not an All Pro QB, but his early struggles may be reduced if the OL can get their shit together (though this could probably be said for all QBs).

by Greetings from the Lord Humongous! on Sep 3, 2011 11:00 AM PDT reply actions  

When he has more time

It gives him a better opportunity to make a bad decision. End Zone interception.

by KidDanger on Sep 3, 2011 11:07 AM PDT up reply actions   1 recs

Zing!

Your thorough and detailed analysis completely undermined my argument.

by Greetings from the Lord Humongous! on Sep 3, 2011 11:12 AM PDT up reply actions  

He has a point though

TJ’s bad pocket presence/awareness is just one of his problems. There’s no guarantee he’ll even be competent once he has protection

Formerly Known As Vasilii

by Thomas Beekers on Sep 3, 2011 11:16 AM PDT up reply actions   1 recs

TJ has happy feet like no other.

Drives me crazy.

The only thought I have about the QBOTF is how big Carroll's smile would be if he snatched Andrew Luck away from Jim Harbaugh.
Follow the llama tail

by Wayward Llama on Sep 3, 2011 11:24 AM PDT up reply actions  

That's not really an argument I'm trying to make

TJ produced at an absolutely shit level for the first 3 preseason games. Tons of people cited protection concerns that undermined his play. When he had more time in the pocket (against a weaker Raiders DL or protected by an improved OL), he played BETTER (but not at a super high level). This is:

a bit of evidence that TJ could look better with more time in the pocket

I’m not going to argue that TJ’s a good QB or a long-term solution at QB or going to play 16 games or won’t be outplayed by CW in the near or long term, but its very clearly possible for him to IMPROVE his play from the absolutely horrible level of the first 3 preseason games.

by Greetings from the Lord Humongous! on Sep 3, 2011 11:24 AM PDT up reply actions  

I agree with you,it is very possible

for him to improve his play. I just hope that those first three games were his rock bottom and that his level of play could only go up from there. It’s is still hard to find his real potential when the defenses were sending the house on every play. I know that alot of his transgressions were because of the lack of effective blitz blocking. I was told though from a special source that those first games were of design. That we had requested the pressure to test our line.

by KidDanger on Sep 3, 2011 12:36 PM PDT up reply actions  

I will be the first to admit that I will never be able to give

a thorough and detailed analysis such as the likes of yours or most of the wonderful writers and commentors that we have the privilege of reading each day on this blog. I will try not to even attempt it.

by KidDanger on Sep 3, 2011 11:26 AM PDT up reply actions  

I was being a dick about it. I'm sorry.

My opinion isn’t inherently worth any more than yours.

It just gets my goat when we forget nuance when talking about players (Jennings is always bad, Mebane is always good, etc). TJ’s clearly a bottom-5 QB right now, but he might be able to produce at a higher level if everything (protection, receivers, running game, etc) goes well. There’s a non-negligible range of QB play that we shouldn’t ignore.

by Greetings from the Lord Humongous! on Sep 3, 2011 11:34 AM PDT up reply actions   1 recs

I just have to say

that anyone would be able to produce at a higher level if everything goes well. Even Matt Hasslebeck.

by KidDanger on Sep 3, 2011 12:43 PM PDT up reply actions  

end zone interception was not a bad decision, it was a very bad throw.

The receiver (Golden?) had a step, and the throw was to his back shoulder.

More time in the pocket may give him more time to make a bad throw though…

Smashmouth is the new sexy!

by pqlqi on Sep 3, 2011 12:06 PM PDT up reply actions  

To be fair, he did stare him down

Such that Tate had the safety and CB both there with the ball. I would rather have seen TJ go to the flat for an easier, if shorter and safer gain. his guy was open for at least 8 plus more if a guy or two miss.

by IslandHawk on Sep 3, 2011 12:08 PM PDT up reply actions  

its probably more accurate to say the decision to throw was late. the throw was late.

i’d rather TJax make the throw 1 second earlier when Tate was open and the safety was nowhere near the play.

Smashmouth is the new sexy!

by pqlqi on Sep 3, 2011 12:12 PM PDT up reply actions  

From my position on the field it never would have been a completed pass.

Either the safety or the corner would have had a hand on that ball. Wether it was a second earlier or not.

by KidDanger on Sep 3, 2011 12:39 PM PDT up reply actions  

Tate had a step and a half inside and deep right after he cut behind the DB.

I don’t know if TJax can make the throw required for the completion or if he just threw it after the window of opportunity closed, but Tate looked pretty open from my perspective in the 100 level and on the jumbotron replay. Haven’t seen a replay. I don’t think TJax was under much pressure, but he certainly was looking down the receiver as IslandHawk noted.

Smashmouth is the new sexy!

by pqlqi on Sep 3, 2011 12:51 PM PDT up reply actions  

right=just

Smashmouth is the new sexy!

by pqlqi on Sep 3, 2011 12:52 PM PDT up reply actions  

After last night

I see that if the line gels and gives the qb time, t-jack can be an adequate stop gap for a couple of years.

by Michael Harp on Sep 3, 2011 11:13 AM PDT reply actions  

I would have to say our defense looked good.

It was a perfect example of the “bend but don’t break” defense that we have seemed to adopt under Bradley and Carroll. I actually liked the pass interference plays by our cornerbacks when they were obviously beat by their recievers. I think two of them would have been huge plays and probably ended up touchdowns if it weren’t for those calls. Overall I defense looks as good as it was the start of last season. I am actually confident in Bradley’s ability to call plays if he has the right pieces in place. I have always been skeptical of his performance, so this is saying alot coming from me. Still need to work on those screen passes though. Urgh.

by KidDanger on Sep 3, 2011 11:14 AM PDT reply actions  

In the case of which safeties to keep...

If there’s not much noticeable difference between Bigby and the young guys, I think that lowers the curtain on Atari. Injury-prone safeties with average/slightly above average skills aren’t all that uncommon, why not keep the cheaper, young guys around and see what you really have in them?

I would love to see us develop a young defensive backfield that can play together for years.

by bobbyj0708 on Sep 3, 2011 11:44 AM PDT reply actions  

Was it Richard Sherman who made that leaping pass deflection in the end zone?

If so, that was my favorite play of the game – but what I don’t know if he was beat so bad or the pass badly thrown or what. Looked cool, though.

About the 2011 Seahawks: "And if I laugh at any mortal thing, tis that I may not weep." Byron

by Hawksince77 on Sep 3, 2011 2:34 PM PDT up reply actions  

actually, after thinking a bit more i should back off my comments on Sherman...

as I didn’t pay much attention to the secondary at all in the first half, was watching the interior defense and Curry specifically. he gave up the PI play, he looked really bad covering Moore on another play in the 2nd half, and then I was paying more attention to how Moore was easily beating those lined up opposite him than I was paying attention to was covering Moore. Whoever had dredlocks and was covering Moore in the 2nd half was pretty bad, but again, alot of experts say Moore might be the best receiver on the raiders (better than Jacoby Ford means something, I’ll admit the rest of their receivers are not good), even Campbell said Moore is one of the most surprising rookies he’s ever thrown to. So it might be fair that a rookie DB can’t cover a surprisingly good talent.

on another note, it seems our D had a real soft spot in that game, middle of the field within 10 yards of the line of scrimmage was gold whenever the Radiers went there.

Smashmouth is the new sexy!

by pqlqi on Sep 3, 2011 2:50 PM PDT up reply actions  

It looked to me that the ball was under thrown.

The receiver had a couple steps on Sherman so if the ball was in front of him instead of being under thrown it would of been a sure td

by eohawkfan on Sep 3, 2011 4:01 PM PDT up reply actions  

*blushing*... TJax

Smashmouth is the new sexy!

by pqlqi on Sep 5, 2011 9:10 AM PDT up reply actions  

So, uh

Why didn’t you turn this into a (little bit more expanded) fanpost so I can frontpage it?

Formerly Known As Vasilii

by Thomas Beekers on Sep 5, 2011 11:48 AM PDT up reply actions  

Watching TJax play in real time (without re-watching or studying the game)...

…my impression was that he performed well enough doing easy things for the position. I loved that he actually threw the ball down the field – except that his first such pass seemed so obviously a bad decision/throw, as it appeared as if Tate was bracketed by the CB and safety and had no chance to make the play. This seemed like the kind of play that makes up a coaches mind – against the player, in this case.

And then TJax comes out the next series and makes the best throw all pre-season. I particularly respected it because of what came just before. Nice play, nice throw, nice reception, and it took balls.

Now that pre-season is done, it seems to me that TJax is one of the worst starting QBs in the league (a familiar feeling for a Seahawk fan), and that CW is around average (which is much better), with Josh Portis possibly the better of the three (eventually – in a year or two if he is able to learn the position at the NFL level).

The game was fun to watch, as both the offense and defense showed some success. I have always been a fan of Forsett and he continues to shine. I have been on the fence about Tate, but hopeful, and it looks like he is making progress. The fact that Durham has had any success at all is surprising, in that he was over-drafted (based on most ratings) and how difficult the NFL is for most rookie WRs. He didn’t look like a rookie to me.

I loved the Thurmound PI call. At first I didn’t see the penalty, but on replay he saved a TD as the defense was ultimately able to stop the drive (unless Heyward-Bey drops the ball – because it looked like a perfect pass). The defense gave me a feeling I haven’t had in awhile – that they could stop the run, rush the passer, make a play down field. Instead of cringing when they took the field I’d get fired up to watch.

As has already been pointed out, the Raiders didn’t look very good, but even so, it was a good game for Seahawk fans.

About the 2011 Seahawks: "And if I laugh at any mortal thing, tis that I may not weep." Byron

by Hawksince77 on Sep 3, 2011 2:51 PM PDT reply actions  

There's no way that Charlie's an average starting NFL QB

He might be better than TJ but I can’t see him being a top-20 guy at this point.

by Greetings from the Lord Humongous! on Sep 3, 2011 3:59 PM PDT up reply actions  

Yeah, I would be hard-pressed to name 12 starting QBs that are worse...

…lets see, Tennessee, Carolina, Cincinnati, San Francisco, Miami (toss up), Jacksonville, NYJ (toss up), Minnisota (toss up), Denver (toss up), Buffalo (toss up), Cleveland (toss up), KC (toss up), Oakland (toss up) – so that makes 13. I’d say that puts CW close to average – perhaps a bit below.

About the 2011 Seahawks: "And if I laugh at any mortal thing, tis that I may not weep." Byron

by Hawksince77 on Sep 3, 2011 6:26 PM PDT up reply actions  

Its obviously a subjective question, but I don't think Charlie's demonstrated he's better than a lot of those guys

and he ranked 41st in DVOA according to Football Outsiders:

http://www.footballoutsiders.com/stats/qb

This puts him behind the likes of both Niners’ Smiths, Campbell, McCoy, Anderson, Collins, Young, Sanchez, Fitzpatrick, Wallace, let alone any QB that is actually any good.

by Greetings from the Lord Humongous! on Sep 3, 2011 9:06 PM PDT up reply actions  

Yeah your sample size sure beats out any subjective opinion

“There’s no way”
Absolutes completely defeat most arguments because they usually aren’t true.
I can say he isn’t an average NFL QB, but only because he hasn’t started enough games to prove it to me. I don’t know that he can’t be either though. With is talent and skill level, if you put him on a team like the Jets or the Ravens, I think he would definitely be a league average QB. That’s the type of team we are trying to build by the way.

by stufr on Sep 4, 2011 5:43 AM PDT up reply actions  

Yeah, I was a little hyperbolic

Lets put it this way: I don’t think its impossible for him to play at a league-average level (somewhere around a Cassel or a Flacco), but his level of play so far (vs NFL starters) has been well below league-average level. I think we all have a tendency to overvalue our own players (except for the goats, which we can tend to undervalue).

by Greetings from the Lord Humongous! on Sep 4, 2011 10:07 AM PDT up reply actions  

DT McDonald looked pretty bad on quite a few plays.

There were times when the O-linemen were knocking him back a couple of steps with one-handed pushes. He got more penetration as the game went on, but not as much as Wilkerson.

I was impressed with FB Boyce. He did a good job picking the right guy to block – especially LBs in the second level. He wasn’t knocking defenders backward, but once he blocked them, they stayed blocked. Too bad he probably won’t make the team.

Moffitt looks good sometimes and awful other times. You can read his body language when he messes up. Looks a lot better than Unger did his first year, especially on the move and blocking in the second level.

by Groundhog on Sep 3, 2011 4:42 PM PDT reply actions  

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