On the NFL Draft and Rebuilding a Roster: Pete Carroll and John Schneider, a Year Later Part I
The following quotes are all from a few interview transcripts I found on the Seahawks media site, and are from just under a year ago, taken just before and just after the 2011 Draft, I believe. I bring them to your attention for two reasons. One, I just found them. Two, I find them interesting.
Actually, two more reasons - a) we're nearing Draft time and they may be applicable or illuminating, and b) it's intriguing to look back a year and see the manifestation of some of the things they're talking about in regards to this team getting younger, faster, stronger, and most importantly, deeper at every position. I'm exceedingly fascinated with the front office and just the methodical nature in which it appears they're working. How does the Seahawks organization work, from a business practices perspective? How do they grade players? What do they do to prepare? What's it like having such a sweet ass job? These quotes don't tell us everything and like anything you have to take them with a grain of salt, but I find them interesting nonetheless.
Some of these might be pretty familiar, but provide good talking points. First off, a little on John Schneider's vision for the team from one year ago:
"I would like to be younger. The way we finished the [2010] season was great, philosophically for Pete (Carroll) and his staff and the culture of the team and the culture of the locker room and buying into his philosophy."
"But, we didn't have that much depth and you guys saw how many transactions we made to just try and add quality depth. And then we got to a point in the season where we started getting hit hard with injuries and we started running out of guys and had to add some veteran-types. So we did some things to just fill some holes where we ended up getting a little older."
Schneider is likely referring to injuries suffered on the defensive line in particular, I would think. They brought back then 30-year old Craig Terrill and played 32-year olds Junior Siavii and Raheem Brock probably more extensively than they wanted. In terms of the age factor that he constantly cites, other key contributors during the 2010 season were 37-year old Lawyer Milloy, 30-year old Colin Cole, 28-year old Jordan Babineaux, 28-year old Lofa Tatupu, 30-year old Marcus Trufant, and 28-year old Kelly Kennings.
None of those players remain, save for Trufant, who is now a free agent and may not return.
On the offensive side, the Seahawks ran with then 33-year old Ben Hamilton for a while, Chester Pitts (31) at times, Chris Baker (31), Sean Locklear (29), Chris Spencer (28), Stacy Andrews (29), Brandon Stokley (34), and of course Matt Hasselbeck (35). Kicker Olindo Mare was 37 and Julius Jones (29) and Deion Branch (31) started the year with the team.
None of these players remain. Schneider continued:
"We want to be young, tough, smart, fast, and aggressive. We want that to be our staple and get this roster where every year we go into the draft that is what we are doing - we are just adding to that group."
This is just a reminder of the point that many have made around here that the veteran group from the 2010 season were mostly stop-gap solutions for the front office so they could get their roster where they wanted it. I don't have the numbers in front of me (though Davis probably does somewhere in his Beautiful Mind), but I'd say the average age on the team has dropped by several years in the past season, which is very, very significant.
Players like Lemuel Jeanpierre (24) and Breno Giacomini (26) replace the Ben Hamiltons and Chester Pittses. Paul McQuistan (28) replaces the Sean Locklears and Stacy Andrewses. Clinton McDonald (25), Pep Levingston (24) and even Anthony Hargrove (28) have begun to replace the Colin Coles, Junior Siaviis, and Craig Terrills.
Anthony McCoy (24) and Cameron Morrah (24) have eliminated the need for the Chris Bakers, i.e., veteran free agent signees, of the world. The churn did in fact have a specific purpose and we saw some of the fruits of that this season.
Carroll, from a year ago, "We're always dealing with trying to fit it together. I think we're much clearer on how to use our players and we also watched how we suffered a little bit when we lost some players that we depended on. So we have that in mind."
"We need to create depth that allows us to maintain the style of play with the guys and not depend too much on one guy. We depended a lot on Red [Bryant] last year and when lost him, it made a difference to us. So we have to find ways to fortify the style of play that we're calling and also guys that can back him up. We found him to be very unique in his play. So we're just growing but the basics of what we do and the foundation of what we do does not change and we're going to add to it and try to compliment better because we have more information now. That's all."
Now, we know that PCJS used free agency and the waiver wire to build this roster and get them younger, faster, bigger, and stronger. I do believe those avenues will still be open to them for a year or two more, at least, and possibly indefinitely, which would be a departure from Schneider's roots with the Ron Wolf methods. Regardless, there is no disputing the emphasis that Pete and John put on the Draft so it's interesting to hear them talk about their methodology there.
The exciting thing about this front office as they move forward is that they will, theoretically, improve in their preparation and collaboration as the scouting departments and coaching staff get more on the same page. The first year was a cluster as JS took the wheel.
He said:
"When we got here last year we didn't want to change their (the scouts) grading scale and what they had going. We had a group of new coaches that we were trying to bring up to speed as much as possible on how we were going to build our board and how the guys were going to be ranked and availability-wise especially. We wanted to make sure these guys were in the basic system they could be in and then I was kind of still on my own, Green Bay format."
While it's still way too early to really judge any of Schneider/Carroll's drafts, they did hit on Russell Okung, Earl Thomas, and Kam Chancellor, and Golden Tate and Walter Thurmond have exciting potential. Anthony McCoy and Dexter Davis are still on my radar as possible contributors down the line as well. So, considering the chips stacked against them there in terms of a lack of harmony and familiarity with each other, impressive.
Going into last year's Draft, Schneider noted:
"It is much easier in terms of preparation because.... this year, we've had our own grading scale, we've added a grade. We've done a lot of great things. Everybody knows what to expect."
Again, way too early, but getting starting caliber players like K.J. Wright and Richard Sherman in the mid-rounds, when taken alone, is very impressive. James Carpenter and John Moffitt should continue to be starting caliber players. Kris Durham, Byron Maxwell, Pep Levingston, and Malcolm Smith are all still around and all saw game action in their first year.
Now, I've heard Schneider talk about that 'grade' they've added several times, and boy I wish I could tell you what it was. But he ain't spilling that.
Schneider went on to talk in more specifics on their methodology in the run up to the Draft and on the actual Draft day, when push comes to shove and they need to make decisions. This is getting longer than I'd thought it would be so I'll follow up soon with that. Stay tuned...
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My guess is that they haven't changed from the GB philosophy
Last year (and possibly the next one or two) was very unique in the number and caliber of free agents, in large part because of the lack of FAs the previous few years due to operating with an expired CBA.
I think it speaks highly of PCJS that they saw this opportunity and adjusted their philosophy. They stuck to their guns, and got young guys (with the exception of Gallery who is at a position where guys have longer careers and also was brought in to help teach Cable’s system), and had first hand knowledge of most of them (through Bevell, Cable, etc.) minimizing risk of a bad fit.
I expect to see PCJS slowly wean off of the FA market unless they see exceptional value. Interestingly, their ability to hit on late round draft picks increases their available salary cap for FAs. Hopefully in a few years as we continue to restock with early round talent that will taper off.
by PerryCollective on Jan 17, 2012 9:59 AM PST reply actions
something tells me carroll and schneider think alike
its clear defensively they know how to pick up starting caliber players and getting the most out of them. this is exciting news. i really like the idea of a seattle team that whoops you starting from the dline out
Funny, I thought of Little Green Bag from
Reservoir Dogs when I saw it.
Pain or damage don't end the world. Or despair or fucking beatings. The world ends when you're dead. Until then, you got more punishment in store. Stand it like a man... and give some back. - Al Swearengen
I'd go with "Damn it feels good to be a gangsta"
"That's funny. I post here all the time and I never see (you) here."
- GreatGoogly, to John Morgan
"John Morgan IS Field Gulls, asshole!"
by Clendy on Jan 17, 2012 11:06 AM PST up reply actions 1 recs
Alwayz into sumthin' by N.W.A.
"I was 11 or 12 and Quinton was like 30. He was the only dude on the Pop Warner team who had a full mustache and a beard. And he used to drive to Pop Warner games. You're not supposed to be doing that. It was crazy." -Marshawn Lynch
Really?
This is what I get: http://youtu.be/t6FUR_nhGX8
The Q/PM trolling the NFL.
70% of space is covered by dark matter, the rest by ET.
ahhahahahaha
that S$%* is too funny bro, dude looks like a Munster!
"I was 11 or 12 and Quinton was like 30. He was the only dude on the Pop Warner team who had a full mustache and a beard. And he used to drive to Pop Warner games. You're not supposed to be doing that. It was crazy." -Marshawn Lynch
I bet nobody in that office has a case of the Mondays.
Pain or damage don't end the world. Or despair or fucking beatings. The world ends when you're dead. Until then, you got more punishment in store. Stand it like a man... and give some back. - Al Swearengen
I got this killa up inside me. I can't talk to myself so I talk to my diary.
Not the same song, but from the same movie.
It takes a big man to admit when he's wrong. I am NOT a big man.
by SGT Lenny on Jan 17, 2012 10:01 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
E.x.a.c.t.l.y.
Yes, this.
Confuscius say- "Baseball wrong. Man with four balls cannot walk."
by Outside Contain on Jan 17, 2012 12:53 PM PST up reply actions
I thought it fit until I thought I saw Mike Salk in the back there
He’s like Salacious Crumb if you ask me.
Heresy grows from idleness.
Why get Matt Flynn?
"Also, for what it’s worth, if we get Flynn, New England and Detroit are on the schedule!" - SSreporters
by Corax --Nevermore-- on Jan 17, 2012 2:21 PM PST up reply actions
Yup, that is him there
he’s got Wassel next to him
Heresy grows from idleness.
Why get Matt Flynn?
"Also, for what it’s worth, if we get Flynn, New England and Detroit are on the schedule!" - SSreporters
by Corax --Nevermore-- on Jan 17, 2012 2:22 PM PST up reply actions
That picture is pretty bitchin'
I feel like I’m watching Office Space when when they’re about to gang up on that printer.
by Carl Shinyama on Jan 17, 2012 9:08 PM PST up reply actions
I always just hear Schneider snarl, "My body is ready."
Head of catering.
by jacobstevens on Jan 18, 2012 4:00 PM PST up reply actions
. . . if Richard Gere had talent.
"Baseball isn't the world's best distraction, but only because it's so easy to start a fire." --Jeff Sullivan
by The Ancient Mariner on Jan 17, 2012 11:24 AM PST up reply actions
He's pretty good with animals and hiding stuff.
Pain or damage don't end the world. Or despair or fucking beatings. The world ends when you're dead. Until then, you got more punishment in store. Stand it like a man... and give some back. - Al Swearengen
It Feels Like
That this training camp coming up will be the most competitive in all areas on the team, because they want to keep their core guys and add. It’s a good place to be in.
If the projected 13 people make their way out, (and I’m not going to even guess who)
they will be fighting for their jobs, and either way, it makes the team better and deeper every year.
It’s like distillation, you concentrate the good and throw away the rest. In a few years, the team should have a very strong core, and even fringe players will want to be on that deep and talented of a squad.
Great write up and thoughts on this scouting process.
Live work and breathe like an optimist.
Another great article
Its ridiculous how fortunate we are to have these two at the helm in terms of choosing talent for our team. I feel like JS hasn’t strayed much from the packers philosophy but is now taking it too another level and taking even more risks in finding guys with the highest ceilings regardless of school or projected draft positions. These guys know what makes a great player and don’t let the media dictate how they build a team. I look at it like so many huge gaps where filled last season and am really excited to see what these two geniuses whip up in the off season. GO HAWKS!
"I was 11 or 12 and Quinton was like 30. He was the only dude on the Pop Warner team who had a full mustache and a beard. And he used to drive to Pop Warner games. You're not supposed to be doing that. It was crazy." -Marshawn Lynch
by IMIN4LIFE on Jan 17, 2012 11:45 AM PST up reply actions 1 recs
I think Pete makes the Packers formula better
No way would Pete be happy with a defense as bad as the Packers
by B.B.Finnegan on Jan 17, 2012 12:00 PM PST up reply actions
I don't think the Packers are happy with it either, but I take your point.
"The time has come," the Walrus said, "to talk of many things."
Sometimes the Packers formula is just to cute for their own good.
Their “formula” of letting free agents walk and replacing them with youth probably cost them the super bowl this year.
The main difference between this years Packers and last’s on D is Cullen Jenkins who they let walk rather than pay. Bye bye edge rush, hellos double teams to Mr. Matthews and one of the worst D’s in the league. Losing their safety to Nick Collins to IR hurt as well-but Matthews’ production from last year is ay down and the Pack got zero pass rush all season.
That 5 year 25 million dollar contract Jenkins got must seem pretty cheap to them in retrospect.
70% of space is covered by dark matter, the rest by ET.
The Packers formula also exists in a different ownership environment.
They’ve got shareholders, we’ve got one of the richest people in the world who let Holmgren throw cash around from time to time. So I could see a little more FA addition/retention than we see from GB. But not the old-guy sucker bets that The Walrus liked.
Packers have plenty of money.
And they deal with the same cap as everybody else. And they are a non profit.
70% of space is covered by dark matter, the rest by ET.
Draft, Free Agency and Santa's Wish List
While JS is familiar and comfortable with the GB methodology of using the draft to get better, we still aren’t at a point where we could rely purely on the draft. Being $20M under the cap gives them a little room if they want to use it.
I would be very happy if they were able to get Mario Williams and either Michael Bush or Peyton Hillis as a RB to compliment a re-signed Beast Mode. If they were able to accomplish that and trade up to get RGIII, I would be thinking Santa is real.
Yes.
These are my thoughts on the realistic best case scenario. I would probably replace your FA RBs with Polk in the draft, but I suppose you weren’t talking draft in that comment. Either way the idea is certainly unlikely, but still in the realm of creative probability.
by brugg on Jan 17, 2012 7:28 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
Thinking on the draft
I we picked up both of those FA and then traded up to #2 or #3 to get RGIII, I doubt we’d have a lot of draft left to take Polk.
Bush and Hillis are both young enough to have a reasonable career in Seattle while being excellent receiving out of the backfield in a 3rd down role. In the event Lynch were to go down, either could also serve as a feature back.
This would still leave us with a need at DE and LB, but if JS/PC acould pull this off I would be very happy.
Yes, Trufant is a free agent
As are Clipboard Jesus (Whitehurst), Marshawn Lynch, Justin Forsett, Michael Robinson, John Carlson, Breno Giacomini, Paul McQuistan, Red Bryant, Anthony Hargrove
Raheem BrockDavid Hawthorne
And Leroy Hill, if we're talking starters.
ONLY IN SEATTLE:
By swaggering could I never thrive,
For the rain, it raineth every day.
woops - should have read the next comment
ONLY IN SEATTLE:
By swaggering could I never thrive,
For the rain, it raineth every day.
OK, has something happened on that front since this list was put out?
Danny O’neill put together this blog post on Jan 2nd. http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/seahawksblog/2017147148_seahawksfreeagencygoodintentionsgreateruncertainty.html
And Trufant isn’t on it and I didn’t see any other post where he has been mentioned as a free agent unless I just missed it. I was of the understanding that he had his contract restructured last year but was still under contract for 2012 (and beyond) at a very high rate, leading to speculation that he likely will be asked to restructure or possibly be cut.
by William Bryan on Jan 17, 2012 8:31 PM PST up reply actions
He restructured his contract.
less money in 2011, free agent in 2012.
Brian Mcintyre just tweeted thia at me
brian_mcintyre
@williamLbryan Signed thru 2013
by William Bryan on Jan 18, 2012 12:56 PM PST up reply actions
Oops, not complete
As are Clipboard Jesus (Whitehurst), Marshawn Lynch, Justin Forsett, Michael Robinson, John Carlson, Breno Giacomini, Paul McQuistan, Red Bryant, Anthony Hargrove, Raheem Brock, David Hawthorne Leroy Hill and Atari Bigby.
May have missed a few, but that is the bulk of them I believe. Other than Lynch and MRob, not too sure how many of them will be back.
Bryant, for sure, if at all possible (and likely, as he is worth the most to the Seahawks)
I think they also liked Hargrove and several of the o-linemen – McQuistan, I think. Again, who else do they to compete with to keep them? Lynch is the only high-profile guy there (other than Carlson) they for sure want to keep. I expect Carlson gets offered something, and I am going to hate to see Forsett go, if that happens, but oh well…
ONLY IN SEATTLE:
By swaggering could I never thrive,
For the rain, it raineth every day.
I personally think that we will see one of either Hawthorne or Hill back.
I don’t see it likely that we would let both of them walk, even if we pick a LB in Round 1 or 2.
Also, I think that Giacomini and McQuistan will both be back as depth unless they receive better offers from other teams.
Eternally looking forward to someone making a Seahawks song based off of Lil' Jon's "Shots" song named "Hawks!"
I sure hope that the Heater's issues were injury related.
He seemed to age so dramatically this year that one has to think it was all due to injury. I wonder if when recovered he can get back his speed. Also, was he ever really that fast? I remember thinking he was, but I’m not so sure.
by brugg on Jan 17, 2012 7:37 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
Makes me want to see the next installment
from Davis’ series with the charts. Must. See. Seahawks. Contract. Spreadsheet.
It was just intense, and it was ball, and it was juice. The juice level in that room was high, and it was awesome.
Great article
One thing I’m looking forward to this offseason/draft: QB. It struck me while I was listening to Brock and Salk today – Alex Smith might be way better than we thought (I don’t have an opinion either way). Bradford is arguably STL’s franchise QB. Ariz won’t be looking for a QB with Skeleton Man and Corn Cob. But we don’t have a ‘gem’ type of guy. Tjack isn’t it. Now, will the game manager thing work? No idea. But it feels like the rest of the NFCW has already stepped their game up in that dept., and time for us to do the same. Also, I’m all for giving Tjack another year, I just feel like most people that he’s hit his ceiling (average qb, maybe decent veteran backup material).
Heresy grows from idleness.
Why get Matt Flynn?
"Also, for what it’s worth, if we get Flynn, New England and Detroit are on the schedule!" - SSreporters
by Corax --Nevermore-- on Jan 17, 2012 2:19 PM PST reply actions
About Brock and Salk and QBs
What about the blank check of first rounders for Luck that Salk is always proposing?
by Heaven for the Air, Hell for the Company on Jan 17, 2012 6:05 PM PST up reply actions
Enlighten me.
That seems pretty ridiculous. About as ridiculous as any comment coming from commercial radio.
by brugg on Jan 17, 2012 7:42 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
Basically Mike Salk has said time and again
that he’d be fine with giving up say 3-4 1st rounders to move up to the number one pick and take Luck.
I don’t see it happening because if I were Indy I’d be taking Luck. However, if they do stick with Manning or just decide to shop the pick, I’d be fine with giving up 4 1st rounders because a) value can be found later in the draft and b) picking flashy skill players or lineman gets you nowhere without THAT guy.
by Heaven for the Air, Hell for the Company on Jan 17, 2012 9:51 PM PST up reply actions
Put yourself in Indianapolis' shoes.
Of course that’s ridiculous because everybody knows an indianapolian wears uncomfortable shoes, but say they didn’t, wouldn’t you trade this first for three future firsts and some jerky? Of course you would! Damn, I love jerky.
I can’t see anyone offering more than that and Indianapolis would be foolish to pass on three or more 1st round picks.
by brugg on Jan 17, 2012 11:56 PM PST via mobile up reply actions
Balance?
If you would trade 3 first-round picks for Luck in a heartbeat, why would Indy be foolish to pass on them?
Well.
Because Indy has so many holes that a rookie QB would not likely fix. And we have our team set up to be able to trade picks for a potentially elite QB.
Indy could potentially rebuild their team in a few years with all those picks or have Luck and if he busts they have nothing. The Hawks have a lot of talent and have shown they can find talent ion later rounds so they would be able to afford moving a few 1st rounders for a QB.
I’m not necessarily advocating doing this, just stating the logic behind the idea.
by Hopefulmsfan on Jan 18, 2012 5:12 AM PST up reply actions
Manning is gone from Indy
You don’t fire everyone running a team and then stick with an aging QB with a $28M pricetag and medical issues. Manning was a favorite of the regime that you just got rid of. Why would you not make a clean break and start the rebuild in earnest?
The best thing that could happen for us is for the Browns to sign Flynn and the Redskins signing Manning. That would give us the opportunity to get RGIII at the 7 position (Jaguars) much, much cheaper draft wise than the #2 position from the Rams if they were even willing to deal with us.
by Aztecs on Jan 18, 2012 4:00 AM PST up reply actions 1 recs
http://www.fieldgulls.com/2012/1/17/2714417/how-the-seahakws-stole-the-qbotf
I think we can get Luck or RG3
by Twisted_Logic on Jan 18, 2012 10:30 AM PST up reply actions
I'd be comfortable with it
Considering our FO has no problem finding talent at later rounds.
"You are the molders of their dreams." - Clark Mollenhoff

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